Sentence Correction

Stacey Koprince wrote:

Can you please look at the following link....looks like people are having different opinion....

https://www.beatthegmat.com/gerund-being ... tml#135844

Can you please tell what indeed is the case ?

So, yes, in a setup where you have a noun that is modifying a gerund, you could put that noun in the form of a possessiven noun (that is, turn it into an adjective) in order to modify the other noun (the gerund).

This is not wrong grammatically, necessarily. It's just almost always considered "awkward" by both the GMAT and most of our ears.

I really dislike the problem at the above link. On the real GMAT, I think the correct answer would have said something more like "Any allegations of John's involvement in..." as the real GMAT generally tries to avoid the "possessive noun + gerund" setup. (Not always, but most of the time - just like it mostly avoids using "being.")

That problem also makes the distinction in some choices of using the article "a" before the word "choice" and sometimes dropping the article. That also seems atypical of the GMAT to me.

I really, really would not study the problem at the above link.

Thanks a lot Stacey !!!

You really really help remove a lot of misconception from the btg people's mind....

I think this thread is a treasure trove of concepts and misconceptions removed

Stacey Koprince wrote:

For the farmer who takes care to keep them cool, providing them with high energy feed and milking them regularly,Holstein cows are producing an average of 2275 gallons of milk each year.

A. providing them with high energy feed and milking them regularly, Holstein cows are producing
B. providing them with high energy feed ,and milked regularly, the Holstein cow produces
C. provided with high energy feed, and milking them regularly, Holstein cows are producing
D. provided with high energy feed ,and milked regularly, the Holstein cow produces
E. provided with high energy feed ,and milked regularly, the Holstein cows will produce

OA : E

hi STACEY,
plz clarify
i want to know what is the role of modifier "providing"
The "comma -ing" part/here is clearly providing additional detail about the main clause.

The "comma -ing" part should be commenting on the preceding clause. The problem? The stuff preceding the comma is not a clause. "For the farmer (who takes care to keep them cool)" is just a noun followed by a noun modifier. So, we have to change the sentence somehow. (Plus, it makes it sound like the farmer is keeping them cool by giving them a certain kind of food and milking them... but that doesn't make a lot of sense...)

One way is to turn this into a list of three things:
"For the farmer who takes care to keep them (a) cool, (b) provided with high energy feed and (c) milked regularly, Holstein cows..."

For the farmer who takes care to keep them cool
For the farmer who takes care to keep them provided with high energy feed
For the farmer who takes care to keep them milked regularly

See the parallelism?

THANKS STACEY

The increased popularity and availability of televisions has led to the decline of
regional dialects, language variations which originate from diverse ethnic and
cultural heritages and perpetuated by geographic isolation.

(A) which originate from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(B) that originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(C) originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(D) originating from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(E) originating from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuating
[spoiler]OA:D[/spoiler]
I choose C
Hi, Stacey
plz clarify

Stacey Koprince wrote:The earlier discussion on this thread was about -ing words, not -ed words. An "-ed" modifier is a noun modifier, not an adverbial modifier, and should modify the closest primary noun preceding it (in the "comma -ed" setup).

I'll stop my explanation there - read what I wrote and see if you can figure out how it applies to the 1st problem you posted. If you still have questions, let me know.

Please post the source of the 2nd question if you would like me to comment. Thanks!

Stacey

In your post you have written " An "-ed" modifier is a noun modifier, not an adverbial modifier,"

I have studied things contrary to this . an - ed modifier is a adverbial modifier .
I will quote few examples .....

Three senators reversed their vote on the controversial tax bill , prodded by public opinion.

since adverbs answer the question where , when , why , how and how often - " prodded by public opinion" is a adverb because it answers the question- why did the senators reverse their vote ?they reversed because they were prodded by public opinion .......


past participle phrases when they work as a modifier can function as the adverb of reason ....

vineet0120 wrote:The increased popularity and availability of televisions has led to the decline of
regional dialects, language variations which originate from diverse ethnic and
cultural heritages and perpetuated by geographic isolation.

(A) which originate from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(B) that originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(C) originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(D) originating from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(E) originating from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuating
[spoiler]OA:D[/spoiler]
I choose C
Hi, Stacey
plz clarify

Hi Vineet,

IMO, The above is testing the past participle and present participle parallelism....

originating = present participle...correct...since dialects still originate(also original sentence gives us hint in this direction..where it uses "originate")
perpetuated = past participle...since TV etc. has made the same of past...so correct....

There is one similar example in OG.....filigre......OG uses extending ...and discoverd there....

abhasjha wrote: since adverbs answer the question where , when , why , how and how often - " prodded by public opinion" is a adverb because it answers the question- why did the senators reverse their vote ?they reversed because they were prodded by public opinion .......

Hi Abhas,

Not directly related to your question.....but probably there is something more to it...

Manhattan SC guide gives one example of usage of adverb....

Max's grandmother is his supposedly Irish Ancestor.

Here supposedly is an adverb modifying adjective Irish...but looks like adverb do more than "where , when , why , how and how often"...since none of these questions seems to be answered by "supposedly" here....

goelmohit2002 wrote:

vineet0120 wrote:The increased popularity and availability of televisions has led to the decline of
regional dialects, language variations which originate from diverse ethnic and
cultural heritages and perpetuated by geographic isolation.

(A) which originate from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(B) that originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(C) originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(D) originating from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuated
(E) originating from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages and perpetuating
[spoiler]OA:D[/spoiler]
I choose C
Hi, Stacey
plz clarify

Hi Vineet,

IMO, The above is testing the past participle and present participle parallelism....

originating = present participle...correct...since dialects still originate(also original sentence gives us hint in this direction..where it uses "originate")
perpetuated = past participle...since TV etc. has made the same of past...so correct....

There is one similar example in OG.....filigre......OG uses extending ...and discoverd there....

Mohit,
but, present participle does not indicate that dialects is still originating ,it just indicates the time of main verb.
plz. clarify

vineet0120 wrote:
Mohit,
but, present participle does not indicate that dialects is still originating ,it just indicates the time of main verb.
plz. clarify

IMO this is the case with comma + ing....here the same is without comma + ing....

without comma + ing present partciple modifies the immediately preceding noun....basically IMO here....

.....language variations originating.... =.....language variations that originate.....

but, which A and B is not given in question. so, why ??
So, in C, the "which A and B" part would read:
variations which originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages
and
(variations which) perpetuated by geographic isolation

originated from diverse ethnic and cultural heritages
and
perpetuated by geographic isolation --- both are parallel

CONFUSED BETWEEN C AND D.

Hi vineet ,

Let me clear your doubt .

The -ing form is used for DOING the action, which means SUBJECT, which means ACTIVE voice.

The -ed form is used for RECEIVING the action, which means OBJECT, which means PASSIVE voice.

Before I go further, let me offer two examples that will make things clearer as we go along:
• speaking person (the -ing form)
• spoken words (the -ed form)


Language variations originate from various ethnic and cultural heritages' ----> So 'originate' modifies the subject 'language variations'. So '-ing form' originating
'Geographic isolations perpetuate language variations' ---> So 'perpetuate' modifies the object 'language variations'. So '-ed form' perpetuated


An idea of how active sentences are converted into passive would also give you and idea as to how we can determine an object :

Let me give you an example :

Congress funded the clean up (active form) .

When written into passive form

The clean up was funded by congress .

The subject of the active sentence - “the congress ” follows by phrase ( by congress) in the passive sentence .

This is a hint enough that if the sentence were written in the active form then congress would be subject and clean up the object .


In the question that you posted :

Language variations Perpetuated by geographic isolation

When converted into active :

Geographical isolation perpetuates language variation ……


So language variation acts as an object here and therefore should be in –ed form . that is perpetuated .


So option D is the correct choice .


In case you wish to solve a similar problem , here it goes …….



The growth of the railroads led to the abolition of local times, which was determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing from city to city, and to the establishment of regional times.

(A) which was determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing
(B) which was determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and which differed
(C) which were determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing
(D) determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differed
(E) determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing


the answer is E

abhasjha wrote:
The growth of the railroads led to the abolition of local times, which was determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing from city to city, and to the establishment of regional times.

(A) which was determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing
(B) which was determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and which differed
(C) which were determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing
(D) determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differed
(E) determined by when the sun reached the observer’s meridian and differing


the answer is E

Hi Abhasjha,

Thanks. I was confused between C and E here......can you please tell why the answer cannot be C here ?