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which/where split

Expert replies
by aimscore » Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:04 pm
At Battle Mountain, Nevada, a perennially powerful girls' basketball team has become a path to college for some and a source of pride for a community where the household incomes of 45 percent of them are below the poverty level.

A. where the household incomes of 45 percent of them are
B. where they have 45 percent of the household incomes
C. where 45 percent of the household incomes are
D. which has 45 percent of the household incomes
E. in which 45 percent of them have household incomes

OA to follow

Source : BTG Questions
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Source: — Sentence Correction |

by Brian@VeritasPrep » Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:02 pm
Hey aimscore:

Great question! This is another example of a question in which you're going to be best served by looking at major error categories first:

1) Pronouns: Choices A and E both use the pronoun "(of) them". But what does "them" refer back to? The only plural noun in the sentence is "incomes", and since "of them" is used to describe "incomes", "them" cannot refer to incomes. A and E are incorrect because of a Pronoun error.

Similarly, B makes the same mistake, just with "they". "They" doesn't have a plural antecedent (or any antecedent, really), so B is incorrect and you're down to C and D.

2) I'd look at the logic of choice D as being off...it's an inaccurate statement to say that the community possesses ("has") 45% of the household incomes. Choice C is much cleaner - the incomes are below the poverty level, and that's logically correct. Choice D is both illogical in its possessive use of "(community) has 45% of the incomes", and it's a wordier, more awkward statement as well.

3) Where vs. Which - I could be wrong here, but while "where" can only modify a location (and therefore works for "community"), "which" isn't necessarily incorrect in modifying a place. For example, "My parents just moved to a retirement community, which requires that each member pay dues..." would be a perfectly fine application of "which". So in this case, I'd view the more idiomatic "which vs. where" decision as a smokescreen to throw you off the scent of the more-concrete Pronoun errors and then the decision between the logic/fluency of C vs. D.

Word to the wise - look for the most common decision points (verbs, pronouns, etc.) before getting too wrapped up in idiomatic decisions. Where and Which as modifiers are decent decision points, but in this case the idiomatic decision between them really doesn't get you too far.
Brian Galvin
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by aimscore » Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:03 pm
Thanks Brian,

This is the explanation I was looking for !!
The answer is indeed C !!

Coming back to the topic of which vs where - I see you have written that Where vs. Which - I could be wrong here, but while "where" can only modify a location (and therefore works for "community"),
how is community a location here ?? Community means society and it isnt a location..
Infact I figured that since community is not a location, I should not use where :( and hence eliminated C :( without thinking a second thought :(

Thanks for pointing out the important fact that it is always important to eliminate answers on grammar rules and worry about the idioms later !
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by beatgmat01 » Wed Nov 03, 2010 5:24 am
I agree with aimscore, I also eliminated option C considering that community is not a location. Brian, can you please explain?
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by limestone » Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:08 am
My approach:

I'll eliminate all choices that have "they/their/them" as we don't know what these three words refer to.
So only C and D remain.

In D, if "which" replaces for "community", it can be understood as:
---- Community has 45 percent of the household incomes ----
Actually speaking, how can a community has incomes? A household, however, has. And, community is a place where households are in. So C is correct.

For example:

It's my house which has three rooms. => These three rooms are parts of my house.
It's my house where my kids live. => My kids are not parts of my house. They are related/belong to me. My house is just a place WHERE they live. So we cannot use "which" here.
"There is nothing either good or bad - but thinking makes it so" - Shakespeare.
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by Brian@VeritasPrep » Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:53 am
Hey guys,

Well, first, that's exactly why I wholeheartedly recommend making decisions on idioms only after you've exhausted the other options! Limestone's explanation using the pronouns and then the logic is perfect.


For "community" - would everyone agree that "city" could definitely be a place? "Community" is a pretty close synonym to "city" in that you could say:

Plymouth is a city of nearly 20,000 people

or

Plymouth is a community of nearly 20,000 people

There are probably some shades of gray in there..."city" means "place" but also refers to the government of that place, and "community" may sway a little more toward the organization/culture of the people than to the land mass itself, but calling either a "place" isn't wrong.

I guess that's really the trouble with making idiomatic decisions on these questions...there are enough shades of gray in each idiom that it's hard to be entirely certain in many of these cases, while the bigger-picture errors are much more black-and-white.
Brian Galvin
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Chief Academic Officer
Veritas Prep

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by arora007 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:13 am
limestone wrote:My approach:

I'll eliminate all choices that have "they/their/them" as we don't know what these three words refer to.
So only C and D remain.

In D, if "which" replaces for "community", it can be understood as:
---- Community has 45 percent of the household incomes ----
Actually speaking, how can a community has incomes? A household, however, has. And, community is a place where households are in. So C is correct.
Like limestone I too eliminated A B and E with "they/their/them" .
Since I recently started understanding community as a place to reside I picked up C( earlier being a non-native I used to understand community as a group only, and a group of people could have money/an income) had it been that I had not known I would have chosen D.

But sometimes it does happens that one does not know a particular word and has to guess between choices...
Alas!That bridge cannot be crossed easily. Somethings in life may be too late... but a good reading habit is something which will take one a long way and yes...its never too late...
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