BREAKING: Target Test Prep releases Brand New 2026 On Demand GMAT prep course

Redeem

Little Extra Bump... Need help going from 660 to 700+

This topic has expert replies
Post new topic Post Reply
Previous Topic Next Topic
Newbie | Next Rank: 10 Posts
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:31 pm

Little Extra Bump... Need help going from 660 to 700+

by sfufootba11 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:18 pm
So background on how my studying and first attempt went.. I have been studying for just over 2 months using the MGMAT series and the OG books for questions and practice. I was progressing and improving my scores and was gaining confidence. I started with the GMAT Prep test 1 prior to opening anything and got a 550... Sub par on all accounts and it made sense as I have always been extremely weak in english and my math was rusty since high school.

I took the last GMAT Prep #2 on Saturday and got a 690 with a Q48 V37 breakout which is pretty much right on par with where I wanted to test.. I did some more reviewing on some sentence correction things and hoped to maybe luck into a couple extra questions to push passed the 700 today on the GMAT.

I took the test this morning and got a 660 with a 46Q and V35 breakout which was disappointing considering my performance just 2 days ago.

I am going to schedule a retake 31 days from now and tack the retake onto my application for a program that has an additional Round 4 application deadline, the others I just have to live with it. What can I do between now and then to get me over the hump from a 660 to a 700+ I would really like a 720 Q49 V40.

I already have the MGMAT guides and plan on going back through the number properties book again. I am also considering the following books.

PowerScore Critical Reasoning Bible
GMAT Sentence correction Holy Grail
Total GMAT Math
Manhattan Advanced GMAT Math


My practice test scores vary from 44-48Q and 34-38V which is a pretty wide score range.
Top
Source: — GMAT Strategy |
User avatar
MBA Admissions Consultant
Posts: 2279
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2011 7:51 am
Location: New York
Thanked: 660 times
Followed by:266 members
GMAT Score:770

by Jim@StratusPrep » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:54 pm
You are on the right track. Mastering concepts is the key to success.
GMAT Answers provides a world class adaptive learning platform.
-- Push button course navigation to simplify planning
-- Daily assignments to fit your exam timeline
-- Organized review that is tailored based on your abiility
-- 1,000s of unique GMAT questions
-- 100s of handwritten 'digital flip books' for OG questions
-- 100% Free Trial and less than $20 per month after.
-- Free GMAT Quantitative Review

Image
Top
Newbie | Next Rank: 10 Posts
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:31 pm

by sfufootba11 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:03 pm
Thanks... Any reviews on the guides listed above or do you know of any other ones I should try.

I generally pick things up but I need to get some new material to study, I like learning things from different perspectives and hope that studying from a different "teacher" may give me an additional perspective.. It is what I did for the CPA in terms of using multiple guides from different companies.
Top

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 417
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 8:49 pm
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
Thanked: 132 times
Followed by:93 members
GMAT Score:750

by brianlange77 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:59 pm
sfufootba11 wrote:Thanks... Any reviews on the guides listed above or do you know of any other ones I should try.

I generally pick things up, but I also like reading things from different perspectives and hope that studying from a different "teacher" may give me an additional perspective.. It is what I did for the CPA in terms of using multiple guides from different companies.
SFU:

I'll try to give you a bit more than what you might get from opening a fortune cookie. First off, kudos for the improvement you've made so far -- that's really positive and reflects the hard work you've put in to-date.

But now comes the tougher part -- you've obviously made widescale improvement in many areas. Now, to get to that 700+ level, you need to figure out (and focus on) the places in which you haven't made as much improvement as you need to.

Two links for you to peek at -- the first gives some great tips on how to use all the information you already have to figure out where the gaps exist and the second gives some good brain candy about what it takes to get to that 700+ level.

https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... ice-tests/
https://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/7 ... erence.cfm

Thoughts?

-Brian
_________________
Brian Lange
Instructor, Manhattan GMAT
Expert Contributor to Beat The GMAT

Merci, Danke, Grazie, Gracias -- Whichever way you say it, if you found my post helpful, please click on the 'thank' icon in the top right corner of this post.

And I encourage you to click on 'follow' to track all my posts -- all the cool kids are doing it! :-)
Top
Newbie | Next Rank: 10 Posts
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:31 pm

by sfufootba11 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:25 pm
brianlange77 wrote:
sfufootba11 wrote:Thanks... Any reviews on the guides listed above or do you know of any other ones I should try.

I generally pick things up, but I also like reading things from different perspectives and hope that studying from a different "teacher" may give me an additional perspective.. It is what I did for the CPA in terms of using multiple guides from different companies.
SFU:

I'll try to give you a bit more than what you might get from opening a fortune cookie. First off, kudos for the improvement you've made so far -- that's really positive and reflects the hard work you've put in to-date.

But now comes the tougher part -- you've obviously made widescale improvement in many areas. Now, to get to that 700+ level, you need to figure out (and focus on) the places in which you haven't made as much improvement as you need to.

Two links for you to peek at -- the first gives some great tips on how to use all the information you already have to figure out where the gaps exist and the second gives some good brain candy about what it takes to get to that 700+ level.

https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... ice-tests/
https://www.manhattangmat.com/articles/7 ... erence.cfm

Thoughts?

-Brian
I mean as a broad issue for both Quant and Verbal I can say that for a lot of it I don't feel 100% confident on each answer, even the ones I get right. I feel this stems from not having 100% mastery over the integer/number properties.

After doing the entire GMAT Error Log for the OG 13th edition I can say I feel comfortable with nearly all of the algebra based problems as they are more "straight forward" in their process. At least in how my mind works. The exponent problems are also hit or miss for me

In Verbal I have problems retaining all of the individual rules. I went through the entire MGMAT SC book twice and the MGMAT CATs following the study sessions I would nail 95% of the SC questions... So I think going into the retake i just need to devote some time each day drilling SC to keep it fresh. I find that I am hit or miss on the CR sometimes. I didn't really like the approach in the MGMAT book.. just didn't click for me. I in general do "okay" with the reading comprehension, but to get to the 700+ level I need to get better than okay.
Top

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 417
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 8:49 pm
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
Thanked: 132 times
Followed by:93 members
GMAT Score:750

by brianlange77 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:22 pm
sfufootba11 wrote:I mean as a broad issue for both Quant and Verbal I can say that for a lot of it I don't feel 100% confident on each answer, even the ones I get right. I feel this stems from not having 100% mastery over the integer/number properties.

After doing the entire GMAT Error Log for the OG 13th edition I can say I feel comfortable with nearly all of the algebra based problems as they are more "straight forward" in their process. At least in how my mind works. The exponent problems are also hit or miss for me

In Verbal I have problems retaining all of the individual rules. I went through the entire MGMAT SC book twice and the MGMAT CATs following the study sessions I would nail 95% of the SC questions... So I think going into the retake i just need to devote some time each day drilling SC to keep it fresh. I find that I am hit or miss on the CR sometimes. I didn't really like the approach in the MGMAT book.. just didn't click for me. I in general do "okay" with the reading comprehension, but to get to the 700+ level I need to get better than okay.
I'm a bit confused as to how to respond here -- if you don't like approaches, that's fine. I happen to be a big believer in the MGMAT approach, but that's neither here nor there. The thing that confuses me is that if you hope to go into the 700+ range, you need to find at least ONE approach you are comfortable with.

700+ requires MASTERY of the test -- not just an ability to get some problems correct without being 100% sure.

I'm a bit tired, so I am sure this is coming across as cranky, but I think you need to take a step back and figure out how you go from a nice score to test mastery.

Thoughts?
_________________
Brian Lange
Instructor, Manhattan GMAT
Expert Contributor to Beat The GMAT

Merci, Danke, Grazie, Gracias -- Whichever way you say it, if you found my post helpful, please click on the 'thank' icon in the top right corner of this post.

And I encourage you to click on 'follow' to track all my posts -- all the cool kids are doing it! :-)
Top

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 2095
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:22 pm
Thanked: 1443 times
Followed by:247 members

by ceilidh.erickson » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:36 pm
As Brian said, your review process is key here. I also want to add - I find that when students get lower on the real test than on practice tests (by more than a margin of error of +/- 20), it's often due to one of two factors: anxiety or un-test-like practice tests.

If it's the former, it can be a bit harder to fix. The good news is that you've now been through the test once, so the next go-round should be less anxiety-ridden, because you'll know what to expect. Here are a few articles about test anxiety:
https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/
https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/

There's a chance, though, that the difference in scores might be due to the way you take practice tests. Did you take every practice test timed? (Without hitting pause, taking extra breaks, etc). Many students cut themselves more slack on practice tests than they get on the real test; this will artificially inflates scores. Make sure every practice test is as GMAT-like as possible!
I don't feel 100% confident on each answer, even the ones I get right. I feel this stems from not having 100% mastery over the integer/number properties
It's perfectly ok not to feel 100% confident on every answer! As long as you're getting answers right, the GMAT will keep throwing harder and harder questions at you, so it would be hard to feel 100% confident on all of them. One thing that's hard to learn (if you were a high-achiever in high school and college) is to feel ok with 80% or 90% confidence, rather than spending several extra minutes getting to 100% confidence. Learn to trust the "pretty sure, but not totally sure" feeling.

That said, you certainly want to have mastery of the content if you're aiming for a 700+. That doesn't mean you should memorize every iteration of every rule. It means that you should understand the principles well enough to adapt them to any new situation.
Ceilidh Erickson
EdM in Mind, Brain, and Education
Harvard Graduate School of Education
Top
Newbie | Next Rank: 10 Posts
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:31 pm

by sfufootba11 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:39 pm
brianlange77 wrote:
sfufootba11 wrote:I mean as a broad issue for both Quant and Verbal I can say that for a lot of it I don't feel 100% confident on each answer, even the ones I get right. I feel this stems from not having 100% mastery over the integer/number properties.

After doing the entire GMAT Error Log for the OG 13th edition I can say I feel comfortable with nearly all of the algebra based problems as they are more "straight forward" in their process. At least in how my mind works. The exponent problems are also hit or miss for me

In Verbal I have problems retaining all of the individual rules. I went through the entire MGMAT SC book twice and the MGMAT CATs following the study sessions I would nail 95% of the SC questions... So I think going into the retake i just need to devote some time each day drilling SC to keep it fresh. I find that I am hit or miss on the CR sometimes. I didn't really like the approach in the MGMAT book.. just didn't click for me. I in general do "okay" with the reading comprehension, but to get to the 700+ level I need to get better than okay.
I'm a bit confused as to how to respond here -- if you don't like approaches, that's fine. I happen to be a big believer in the MGMAT approach, but that's neither here nor there. The thing that confuses me is that if you hope to go into the 700+ range, you need to find at least ONE approach you are comfortable with.

700+ requires MASTERY of the test -- not just an ability to get some problems correct without being 100% sure.

I'm a bit tired, so I am sure this is coming across as cranky, but I think you need to take a step back and figure out how you go from a nice score to test mastery.

Thoughts?
Totally cool... Sorry I am just a bit lost at this point between the time and the test today... I like the MGMAT approach to the quant section and I feel it really helped me get the bump to the 46 I got today. Based on the MGMAT CATs I noticed that when i started on the first test I didn't get a single 700-800 question correct and was 20-30% on the 600-700. On my last one I was around 75-80% on the 600-700 level questions and 30-40% on the 700-800 level questions.

The approach I didn't like from MGMAT was their approach to the CR and RC. Some was useful but as a whole it just didn't work for me.

I will look back at everything tomorrow to try giving you a more concise answer
Top

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 2095
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:22 pm
Thanked: 1443 times
Followed by:247 members

by ceilidh.erickson » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Here's another that might help you in getting over that last hump:
https://www.beatthegmat.com/what-is-the- ... tml#564654
Ceilidh Erickson
EdM in Mind, Brain, and Education
Harvard Graduate School of Education
Top
Newbie | Next Rank: 10 Posts
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:31 pm

by sfufootba11 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:46 pm
ceilidh.erickson wrote:As Brian said, your review process is key here. I also want to add - I find that when students get lower on the real test than on practice tests (by more than a margin of error of +/- 20), it's often due to one of two factors: anxiety or un-test-like practice tests.

If it's the former, it can be a bit harder to fix. The good news is that you've now been through the test once, so the next go-round should be less anxiety-ridden, because you'll know what to expect. Here are a few articles about test anxiety:
https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/
https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/

There's a chance, though, that the difference in scores might be due to the way you take practice tests. Did you take every practice test timed? (Without hitting pause, taking extra breaks, etc). Many students cut themselves more slack on practice tests than they get on the real test; this will artificially inflates scores. Make sure every practice test is as GMAT-like as possible!
I don't feel 100% confident on each answer, even the ones I get right. I feel this stems from not having 100% mastery over the integer/number properties
It's perfectly ok not to feel 100% confident on every answer! As long as you're getting answers right, the GMAT will keep throwing harder and harder questions at you, so it would be hard to feel 100% confident on all of them. One thing that's hard to learn (if you were a high-achiever in high school and college) is to feel ok with 80% or 90% confidence, rather than spending several extra minutes getting to 100% confidence. Learn to trust the "pretty sure, but not totally sure" feeling.

That said, you certainly want to have mastery of the content if you're aiming for a 700+. That doesn't mean you should memorize every iteration of every rule. It means that you should understand the principles well enough to adapt them to any new situation.
I was very strict on my GMAT Prep Software tests for that reason. I didn't take longer than allowable breaks, I actually took shorter than 8 minute breaks. I really like the last part, though based on how I learn I think I need to drill myself with more of the 700+ questions so that I can see more of the iterations of rules, which may be why the MGMAT guides helped me to the point where I am with the "basic" understanding of the rules, though I still haven't mastered them.

It may have been some test anxiety, though I wouldn't really attribute it to that, I have never had an issue before with any other tests (CPA, SAT, etc)
Top
Newbie | Next Rank: 10 Posts
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:31 pm

by sfufootba11 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:48 pm
ceilidh.erickson wrote:As Brian said, your review process is key here. I also want to add - I find that when students get lower on the real test than on practice tests (by more than a margin of error of +/- 20), it's often due to one of two factors: anxiety or un-test-like practice tests.

If it's the former, it can be a bit harder to fix. The good news is that you've now been through the test once, so the next go-round should be less anxiety-ridden, because you'll know what to expect. Here are a few articles about test anxiety:
https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/
https://www.manhattangmat.com/blog/index ... anagement/

There's a chance, though, that the difference in scores might be due to the way you take practice tests. Did you take every practice test timed? (Without hitting pause, taking extra breaks, etc). Many students cut themselves more slack on practice tests than they get on the real test; this will artificially inflates scores. Make sure every practice test is as GMAT-like as possible!
I don't feel 100% confident on each answer, even the ones I get right. I feel this stems from not having 100% mastery over the integer/number properties
It's perfectly ok not to feel 100% confident on every answer! As long as you're getting answers right, the GMAT will keep throwing harder and harder questions at you, so it would be hard to feel 100% confident on all of them. One thing that's hard to learn (if you were a high-achiever in high school and college) is to feel ok with 80% or 90% confidence, rather than spending several extra minutes getting to 100% confidence. Learn to trust the "pretty sure, but not totally sure" feeling.

That said, you certainly want to have mastery of the content if you're aiming for a 700+. That doesn't mean you should memorize every iteration of every rule. It means that you should understand the principles well enough to adapt them to any new situation.
I was very strict on my GMAT Prep Software tests for that reason. I didn't take longer than allowable breaks, I actually took shorter than 8 minute breaks. I really like the last part, though based on how I learn I think I need to drill myself with more of the 700+ questions so that I can see more of the iterations of rules, which may be why the MGMAT guides helped me to the point where I am with the "basic" understanding of the rules, though I still haven't mastered them.

It may have been some test anxiety, though I wouldn't really attribute it to that, I have never had an issue before with any other tests (CPA, SAT, etc)
Top

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 2095
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:22 pm
Thanked: 1443 times
Followed by:247 members

by ceilidh.erickson » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:59 pm
sfufootba11 wrote:I was very strict on my GMAT Prep Software tests for that reason. I didn't take longer than allowable breaks, I actually took shorter than 8 minute breaks. I really like the last part, though based on how I learn I think I need to drill myself with more of the 700+ questions so that I can see more of the iterations of rules, which may be why the MGMAT guides helped me to the point where I am with the "basic" understanding of the rules, though I still haven't mastered them.

It may have been some test anxiety, though I wouldn't really attribute it to that, I have never had an issue before with any other tests (CPA, SAT, etc)
Glad to hear that you're treating the practice tests like the real thing! That makes a big difference. As for anxiety... sometimes it creeps up on us subtly, without us realizing. If that's the case, hopefully you'll feel less subconscious pressure on the real thing.

In my experience, mastery of the rules means this: could you write your own GMAT-like problems if you wanted to? If so, you probably know what's tested, and how. If not, you might still be treating each problem as a case-by-case issue, without connecting the dots. The way to connect those dots is to study topic-by-topic. For example, find all of the divisibility OG questions you can find. Do or redo a dozen of those in a row, then stop and ask - what are the big themes, and how can I recognize them? What traps/tricks should I be looking out for here?
Ceilidh Erickson
EdM in Mind, Brain, and Education
Harvard Graduate School of Education
Top
Newbie | Next Rank: 10 Posts
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:31 pm

by sfufootba11 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 5:42 am
ceilidh.erickson wrote:
sfufootba11 wrote:I was very strict on my GMAT Prep Software tests for that reason. I didn't take longer than allowable breaks, I actually took shorter than 8 minute breaks. I really like the last part, though based on how I learn I think I need to drill myself with more of the 700+ questions so that I can see more of the iterations of rules, which may be why the MGMAT guides helped me to the point where I am with the "basic" understanding of the rules, though I still haven't mastered them.

It may have been some test anxiety, though I wouldn't really attribute it to that, I have never had an issue before with any other tests (CPA, SAT, etc)
Glad to hear that you're treating the practice tests like the real thing! That makes a big difference. As for anxiety... sometimes it creeps up on us subtly, without us realizing. If that's the case, hopefully you'll feel less subconscious pressure on the real thing.

In my experience, mastery of the rules means this: could you write your own GMAT-like problems if you wanted to? If so, you probably know what's tested, and how. If not, you might still be treating each problem as a case-by-case issue, without connecting the dots. The way to connect those dots is to study topic-by-topic. For example, find all of the divisibility OG questions you can find. Do or redo a dozen of those in a row, then stop and ask - what are the big themes, and how can I recognize them? What traps/tricks should I be looking out for here?
I like that approach.. I registered another one of my Manhattan Books I purchased so I reset the MGMAT CATs so I have access to all 6 again. I will take the next couple days off to reboot my system and report back where it is saying I am struggling. I like the approach of topic studying.. I started with this in the last 2 months but deviated and went book by book instead.

Do you happen to have a breakout of the OG 13 questions by topic? Edit: And subtopic the general error log just does the broad topics.
Top
Post new topic Post Reply
• Page 1 of 1