I screwed up my verbal with 16 again!

Expert replies

Night reader: Legendary Member; Posts: 1337; Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 6:29 pmFollowed by: 10 members; Thanked: 127 times

by Night reader » Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:20 am

I wonder if an algorithm of the GMAT exam has changed, as it is highly unlikely for me to get the score of 16 in verbal in English test, even if it is GMAT and the weight-score is attached differently from other verbal tests. I speak out this paradox, as I have been testing myself continuously with MGMAT CATs and GMAT prep CATs, have used new tests for ESL to check grammar soundness, the Princeton's manual for CR entries and RC99 passages - all indicate that I am able to answer correctly AT LEAST 90% of entries in Grammar, 75% in CR and 65% in RC.

What the hell my score gets pinned in the area of ten percentile??? Can anybody respond ...

My knowledge frontiers came to evolve the GMATPill's methods - the credited study means to boost the Verbal competence. I really like their videos, especially for RC, CR and SC. You do check their study methods at https://www.gmatpill.com

Source: Beat The GMAT — I just Beat The GMAT! | Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:20 am

anasnet: Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts; Posts: 13; Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:27 pmFollowed by: 1 member

by anasnet » Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:03 pm

Totally agree with you , I have taken the GMAT test today and scored 13 on Verbal !

I was able to show 30+ on prep CATs however the test results today has really shocked me

Night reader: Legendary Member; Posts: 1337; Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 6:29 pmFollowed by: 10 members; Thanked: 127 times

by Night reader » Thu Apr 07, 2011 5:32 pm

Without pre-disposition - my problem is that I am initially coming from the school, degree, major and year of which all alumni have never scored below the middle 30-s for GMAT verbal without prep and I had been placed at 86% out of 100% GPA (this is not bad, decent for my degree/year) and I have prepped for GMAT verbal part for quite long time.

I am under influence of my recent show in GMAT with the verbal score and trying to clarify some things for myself. I've written to GMAC two e-mails and received replies which are absolutely irrelevant to my e-mail queries. As such, the GMAC representative has informed me that "No compensation will be given for any of my GMAT exams, and all exams were correct" (have I asked for compensation? I didn't ...) They seem sending out my GMAT score report link in e-mail without reading my request of the different action; moreover one e-mail, I have received, was full of the grammatical mistakes and confusion. The correspondence was held between me and a representative of GMAT Candidate Service EMEA, Dorothy Masey.

I do not know what to do. If the score of 16 is true representation of my verbal abilities, which I doubt for the objective reasons described above, how I should treat my time and energy invested into exam. On the other hand, if the score of 16 is accurate, what is the cause? Could people become smarter since leaving their schools (I graduated 3 years ago) and taking GMAT without much preparation for the verbal part? (laugh-laugh through tears) I really do not have any clue.

rohu27: Legendary Member; Posts: 586; Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:38 amFollowed by: 5 members; Thanked: 31 times; GMAT Score:730

by rohu27 » Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:39 pm

Night Reader,
i must say this is scary especially for someone like me who has yet to take the test. Now with all other things along this is a new prospect to worry upon.
I cannot give any reasoning/justification as such but i have been a huge fan of your posts all through.I still cant digest how can you get 16 on verbal?
I would request you to PM Ron this link and see what he comes up with?

Have time? https://www.beatthegmat.com/730-q-50-v40 ... 88058.html

gmatmachoman: Legendary Member; Posts: 2326; Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2008 3:54 amFollowed by: 2 members; Thanked: 173 times; GMAT Score:710

by gmatmachoman » Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:28 pm

@NR,

I really feel sorry abt this outcome. As I have said in my previous posts, Please dont blame/doubt GMAC algorithm.

When 1000's of people can score 700+ , then it must be that you have done some "mistakes" while answering.

There could be hundred's of resons why u underperformed.

I have done quite extensive study on GMATPrep algorithm. I have shared my opinions & which has been endorsed by co-aspirants also. If at all u have time & interest plz go thru them in the GMAT strategy Section.

Anyways, All the best !

R&D on GMAT algorithm:

https://www.beatthegmat.com/r-d-on-gmat- ... tml#305739

HSPA: Legendary Member; Posts: 1101; Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:26 amFollowed by: 13 members; Thanked: 47 times; GMAT Score:640

by HSPA » Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:47 pm

what is this.. I never expected this mail from Night reader...
Did the length of the exam strain you mental stamina during verbal...

Is 16 the score or 16/41 correct answers???
What I am saying might sound crazy.. but a redbull at start of verbal and in middle are mandatory
atleast for me... verbal strains my stamina a lot...

This is the only reason why after 3 months of prep I still backing from my actual test or the best possible reason is you answered only 38 of 41 and ran out of time..

First take: 640 (50M, 27V) - RC needs 300% improvement
Second take: coming soon..
Regards,
HSPA.

Night reader: Legendary Member; Posts: 1337; Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 6:29 pmFollowed by: 10 members; Thanked: 127 times

by Night reader » Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:03 am

Not at all, I am not blaming CAT algorithm. In fact with so many opportunities to follow the verbal forums here at BTG, and GMATClub, I am convinced that GMAT's algorithm stays untouched. I am only trying to reconcile my verbal abilities by matching the pre-exam progress and general aptitude levels shown with the other standardized tests I have taken. Also, my CAT stats is no way close to my actual exam score. I am ready to quit attempting GMAT for good, since all the material and practice tests I avail have been exhausted by me. I have no f...en clue (apologies) what is going on and how to improve the situation.

vineeshp: Legendary Member; Posts: 965; Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 12:52 amFollowed by: 34 members; Thanked: 156 times; GMAT Score:720

by vineeshp » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:32 am

This sounds scary man. I know GMAT algorithm is perfect and nothing has changed. But then, I have seen NR's posts and answers. He definitely is way better than the V16!

Feels really weird.

NR,
I suggest you give up GMAT for good and concentrate on the GRE. You did well on that. Didn't you?

Vineesh,
Just telling you what I know and think. I am not the expert.

bkw: Master | Next Rank: 500 Posts; Posts: 116; Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:34 pmFollowed by: 1 member; Thanked: 6 times

by bkw » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:33 am

Night reader wrote:I wonder if an algorithm of the GMAT exam has changed, as it is highly unlikely for me to get the score of 16 in verbal in English test, even if it is GMAT and the weight-score is attached differently from other verbal tests. I speak out this paradox, as I have been testing myself continuously with MGMAT CATs and GMAT prep CATs, have used new tests for ESL to check grammar soundness, the Princeton's manual for CR entries and RC99 passages - all indicate that I am able to answer correctly AT LEAST 90% of entries in Grammar, 75% in CR and 65% in RC.

I am sorry to hear about your verbal score. I did score V16 too a week ago, and I thought there was something wrong with there algorithm. But no, GMAC has responded and there is nothing wrong with the score.
I have no idea how you studied, but maybe you should try to analyze whether you were missing any important details. For instance these are things I left out:

- Didn't improve my reading comprehension or speed by e.g. reading magazines/papers
- No careful review of my mistakes although I had an error log
- Skipped the last long RC passage by random guessing four questions which I think dramatically affected my score, say 4 RC Qs wrong in row...

- I did not read SC for meaning, instead I tried to only attack by grammar rules which probably trapped me on the real test when I couldn't find obvious grammar errors in some sentences.
- I thought I could do GMAT magic in a period of 2-3months, but I couldn't.
- Watched the timer, calculated how I was doing pacing wise etc, probably 10 times during each section which impact the timing/stress
- Did not consistently score near or above my target score on practice CATs
- Studied to intensively

Did you repeat CATs? That will change your score dramatically..

I have been on a break for more than a week now to recover from a lowered GMAT score than my first attempt. I have also ordered some new books and will now go with the Veritas book set and try to rework the GMAT concepts. Finally, here is a video I found motivating https://vimeo.com/bubbasour/never-give-up , what it actually tells me is that I can achieve my goal, but I need to give it more time.

Last edited by bkw on Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.

HSPA: Legendary Member; Posts: 1101; Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:26 amFollowed by: 13 members; Thanked: 47 times; GMAT Score:640

by HSPA » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:54 am

No..No.. I strongly suggest not to loose patience...bad luck strucks but only once.. hardwork you kept will go in vain if you drop.. dont let your anger overtake your desire

Champs do raise from where they fall and I felt and do that you are one... one more month of preparation and give your last try after 45 days.. I think 1 month is the minimum period to reapply...

You can mold the iron when it is hot and it is hot now... this fire will hold for your next exam and you dont even need a redbull now ... Dear night RIDER ...victory is around the corner my friend...

First take: 640 (50M, 27V) - RC needs 300% improvement
Second take: coming soon..
Regards,
HSPA.

RadiumBall: Master | Next Rank: 500 Posts; Posts: 132; Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:49 am; Thanked: 5 times

by RadiumBall » Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:11 am

Totally agree with you Night Reader.

Wonder if something has got to do with the date. Even I wrote my test on 7th April 2011 and got a pathetic 17 in Verbal. Quant (43) on the other side felt so cheap I wondering if did the questions right. I wish quant would have been tough and verbal be easy instead.

I surely think that something was terribly wrong with the algorithm. I got almost 25 SC's and they would just not get easier how many ever (supposed) mistakes I made. I don't think you should be getting tough questions when you are making mistakes.

On the whole the verbal was no way close to the OG or the GMAT prep not even MGMAT...the only thing that could be closer is the Kaplan I think...

@gmatmachoman: I request you to take the GMAT again and see for your self what has changed...something surely changed for me at least...or may I was just too unlucky...

anasnet: Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts; Posts: 13; Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:27 pmFollowed by: 1 member

by anasnet » Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:45 am

Guys :

Lets group the maximum number of people who toke the exam on 7th April and have big contrast between their Quant score and their verbal score , personally , it happenned to me , I scored 31 in Quant. and 13 on Verbal !!!

anasnet: Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts; Posts: 13; Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:27 pmFollowed by: 1 member

by anasnet » Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:06 am

If this issue happened to you as well please post your vote here
https://www.beatthegmat.com/urgent-for-a ... 80801.html

Night reader: Legendary Member; Posts: 1337; Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 6:29 pmFollowed by: 10 members; Thanked: 127 times

by Night reader » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:50 am

I read your post and would like to note that the idea is crazy. The GMAT scores and all test related information are strictly confidential. There's no way for people to join and manifest exam administrators with their votes - simply NONE from GMAC will listen to them. The idea is crazy.

I suggest to concentrate on the matters individually. Moreover, I do not claim that my score in verbal is incorrect ... I just need to reconcile my verbal abilities with what shows my result on GMAT.

anasnet wrote:If this issue happened to you as well please post your vote here
https://www.beatthegmat.com/urgent-for-a ... 80801.html

If I score 16 and see a guy who is not able to comprehend an article from Economics, then I match my scores against his and see how far we are split. Of course there can be other matters such as English grammar and logic involved, but this is one exam and the score should reflect the level of verbal competence for all test takers, shouldn't it?

I can tell you that a score of 17 in verbal could be achieved by answering ONLY 10 easy to medium difficulty level questions correctly in GMAT Prep. OK, GMAT Prep has no experimental questions and the number of questions in actual exam could be even 8 or 9 correct questions out of 41. if some one blindly guesses all questions then the verbal score would be 8-9 with 5-6 correct questions.

Let me count my questions answered on exam. Suppose, I managed only 40% accuracy for SC which is totally mad scenario and it's possible if I had only tricky 800 level difficulty questions. But let's count only 6 out of 14! correct in my SC. By the same token I deal CR and take 30% or 4 out of 13. I take also 25% for RC and count 4, i.e. one correct from each passage

Now I have 6+4+4=14 correct answers. I should have managed >17 in verbal (more than 10 questions) - may be 20-21. But I got 16!

Now let's look for possibilities - I ran out of time? No, I spent all of my time wisely, had to make educated guesses on two questions in the passage No 3 and move on ... to finish the test on time. For the last two questions CR and SC I spent 3.5 minutes.

I lost patience for GMAT verbal - No, I was relaxing last two days prior to exam and was hungry for the exam stuff, especially for the verbal since my last score in that section was 16!

I remained idle prior to exam day and did not study GMAT - No, I studied GMAT four weeks to face the verbal challenges in exam (after my unsuccessful attempt on Febr.17).

no clues so far

fitzgerald23: Master | Next Rank: 500 Posts; Posts: 219; Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 8:51 pmFollowed by: 5 members; Thanked: 62 times; GMAT Score:750

by fitzgerald23 » Fri Apr 08, 2011 11:19 am

Do you think its possible that you are just over thinking and over analyzing the verbal questions? Im only familiar with the Manhattan CATs and the one thing I noticed with those exams is that they immediately jump you into tougher questions and seem more forgiving when you get something wrong. By that I mean they always seemed to start off with a 500-600 level question and then you jump right into 700-800. Get one wrong and they might still give you a 700-800 level question. Once it dips down a level it seemed easy to jump back up.

I did find that a bit different than GMAT Prep. It seemed more of a steady climb in verbal rather than a large jump. Where I felt Quant would get harder in the Prep after a few questions questions I felt verbal would take 8 or 9 questions before I would really even notice much of a difference based on the question set. Even on test day there was never a point where I felt in verbal that I was getting anything exceptionally hard or exceptionally easy and I ended up with a 46. Quant was completely different (I scored a 48) and at one point I was getting questions that kind of threw me for a loop and actually made me think I was going to do even better than I ended up doing. Again it wasnt the big jump like Manhattan, which can get ridiculously difficult just a few questions in, but it was noticeable. Verbal never was that noticeable.

The reason I mention that is because most of the questions we see on BTG are relatively difficult. You are likely seeing pretty difficult questions on your CATs. Sometimes when you get used to seeing harder questions you start looking for tricks in the questions or sometimes get the first choice wrong and find the error before submitting by really plowing over the question. When you end up with easy questions that can probably hurt you. There is no trick in those questions. They are straightforward and easy. But if you overthink it you may be finding something that does not really exist in the question. You are only finding it because all the prep work on tougher questions makes you think you have to find some trick in every question. Wen you combine that with the fact that is seems much harder to get the GMAT to jump from easy to hard you may be putting yourself in a position without too much hope.

The other thing that I felt is a bit different in practice is that the actual GMAT seems to jump more from SC to CR and back again. Alot of the practice stuff seemed more centralized. CR CR CR CR CR SC SC SC SC SC RC RC RC RC, etc...Its been some time since I took the exam and any practice tests so that may be totally wrong, but if you get used to one way of seeing questions and getting yourself in the right frame of mind to handle that type it may work against you if your GMAT makes you do a CR followed by a SC.

Good luck. Im sure you will find your answer out.

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