I was totally shocked to know the score when Adi called me after the exam and explained that he too had exactly similar experience as mine. I was always in touch with him throughout and analysed his mock as well. I was sure that he is going to get somewhere b/w 650-680 kind of score but it seems GMAT has evolved and no prep company test, currently available, is anywhere near to the actuals.

I think your remark about 'change of style & strategy' holds very much true. You have already put exhaustive 6 months and I think its time for a break. Hanging out with old known stuff won't help in short term break but after long break 'Yes'.

To some GMAT comes as a breezer with least preparation, but most of us has to go through the hard way. There is a call for one more attempt and chance of redemption, but you need to decide When & How !!

I gave GMAT on 20th sep and the story is not good here also.

Followings were my mock tests scores :

MgMat 6 tests : all 700+
Kaplan : 640, 630 [ people say that add 70-80 in your Kaplan scores ]
Princeton : 630, 640, 650, 610
GMAT Prep1 -- 760 [ 1 week before the test ]
GMAT Prep 2 - 690 [ 2 days before the test ]

So anyway I was expecting a 700+
But I got only 650 [ Math : 49, V : 29 ]

And here are my observations with the test

Math : I solved the first 20 problem in only 35min. So now I had 17 problems and 40 min : enough time. But now GMAT statrts throwing lengthy problems. The languages of the problems were quite lengthy. It was taking more than 1 min to understand the problem only. I could not solve 4 problmes in a row here.
Although I got 49 in math, but I was expecting a 50 here, based on my preparation.

English :
SC : Adi has written the right thing. I can't remember even a single SC which was easy to solve. OG-12/11/10 were on my fingers but for every SC problem, it was not easy to eliminate the 4 wrong choices there.
Still I believe that I did a decent ob there.
CR : From last 2 months, I was solving the LSAT CRs. And my score was around 20-21 out of 23-24 questions. I could not repeat the same accuracy in GMAT. But here also I hope that I was able to get a decent score.
RC : This had been my weakest part. And with my experience, I agree with gmatMacMohan that your score depend heavily on RCs. I am really frustrated with GMAT RCs. My accuracy was always 60-75% only. On the other side my accuracy with LSAT RC was ~80%. So in exam also, I could not do well. I was not able to get the conclusive answer. So most of the time, I guessed the answer and kept moving.

ok This is my story. And finally I got a 650 only.

@ paes

You deserve better. So does adi_800. Fancy another go?

It is interesting to note that your LSAT RCs were better than GMAT RCs. Have you analyzed why? The conventional opinion says that LSAT RCs, in their complexity and extreme time constraints, are more difficult to deal than GMAT RCs.

niksworth@

good question between LSAT and GMAT.

definitely for me, LSAT RC/CR have been easy than GMAT RC/CR.
I have solved ~20 papers of LSAT.
Some reasons/differences, I would like to mention here :

1. On average, LSAT RCs are lengthy than GMAT's. But it is easier to eliminate 4 wrong choices in LSAT than in GMAT RCs.
In GMAT, last 2 answer choices are very close.
2. RC inference question in LSAT are directly paraphrase of a single line or of two lines while in GMAT, the inference question is generally the outcome of a passage or combination of the information given in 2 paragraphs.
3. Tone of the passage/purpose of the passage : such type of general questions are far easy in LSAT. Again here in GMAT, last 2 choices are very close.
4. LSAT CR -> If I compare only the reasoning part (excluding language) then definitely LSAT reasoning is difficult than GMAT reasoning. But for me, reasoning is not the problem, English language is the problem. GMAT English is quite different and subtle. Its language is much more like encyclopedia's language or literature's language. My education medium has been Hindi. For me, understanding a GMAT CR language is difficult than understanding a LSAT language.

In conclusion :
GMAT subtle language is a problem for me.
GMAT short paragraphs -> very complex long sentences -> killer for me
GMAT CR -> question stem : difficult language than LSAT. Ok I will understand the question stem with 1-2 reading but now come to answer choices. Out of 5, here again at least 2 choices will have complex languages -> again killer for me.
GMAT SC -> I don't have the reading habit. I can solve the problems which are some old rule based. But for a new problem, my ears don't support me.

Thanks Paes for the reply...
It seems that you gave test in India...One more bad exp for an Indian guy..
I know this GMAT being tougher in India..This kinda of perception i m getting only coz I have got a low score... i would not have considered whether GMAT is tougher in India if I had got a good score....As matchoman said...This is a standardized exam n u have to live with it...Come what may!!

Regarding LSAT Vs GMAT...cant write much on that as I did not do much of LSAT..

For SC in actual GMAT.. I got one SC that was written as sentence in question format...When i first read..I ws like..what is this? N Yup..it was not easy to eliminate 4 options...

For RC.. after solving official questions and 1000RC, I was in fact used to get a perception while reading that you might be asked questions on this part of RC...I thought i have come to know the PATTERN of RC...So, I used to read that part carefully..This used to happen many times for inference question n this way, i used to get inference question right....But in GMAT, with so much of length for one passage, i was not getting ny idea what is going on and with this, I was asked accord. to passage questions n believe me guys...though they are directly from passage, it was tough to locate the part where to read from due to length...

I m extremely sorry if this is gonna make future test takers tensed...But im simply talking about reality...

Btw...I m waiting for Matchoman for his quant ka reply...

Aditya bhai,

U wont believe, people are reading your posts only.. I have recieved a pm from a buddy called vivnk where I mentioned what's life without Wharton/ Kellogg..Beat the monster...

Hey Adi..u have become really " famous".......

Having said that, quants algorithm is pretty much direct and straight!! from my understanding , ( this holds true for Quants only)

1. Treat first 10- 12 as whip to ride the GMAT MONSTER. If u miss it, GMAT will take u for a RIDE.

Case : first question : 500 level... next one : 700 level..... now u make a mistake... GMAT will give u a 600 level question. Your badluck if u miss tat also..U will be given 500 level.

So what has happened in that time period? U have lost (2+2+2) mins and u lost 2 datapoints that would have been used for determined your Upper control limit.

Now again GMAT may give a 700 level one...u hit it correctly...then a again a 700 level... U would have seen people saying " I got ridiculously easy question whil i was answering 24 or 26 question"..so it means GMAT is looking to "freeze" the Lower control limit.

Sometime back Brian ( Veritas) nicely demystified the algorithm...

He said make the system to react to YOUR tunes and never DANCE to its melodrama!! It means tread the exam path to fix your CIELING and not the floor.

Another key takeaway is : NEVER NEVER make continuous mistakes in first 8-- 10. Becox the system is actively looking ti fix your Upper control limit.

Just think of this scenario, if by badluck in the first 10 u make 2 conitnuous error at 500 -550 levels, then tell me what that DUmb box will think? It will just assume that u r NOT even good enuf to answer 500 levels and will throw 400 levels..

SO be very very careful of where u make mistakes... Mistakes are NOT necessarily LOGICAL..even we tend to make small silly studpid subtraction/ addition mistakes.

One example is if teh question say A is 10% less than B, u r supposed to write quation as A= 0.9B , but due to anxiety if u wrire down as A=0.1 B, then tat's it..u r GONE at 500 levels itself.

SO DO mistakes ..but at HIGHEST levels so that makes the SYSTEM as NOT to underestimate u!!

Another tip is : GMAC assumes Probability copuled with combinatroics as a tough concept . SO give more weightage to it.

As peas said, never never make 4 conituous mistakes. One quick suggestion is if u really feel u r at 700 level while takin test, then I suggest ( @20-25 levels) u can spend 1/2 mins more to finish it off rather than "wasting" that chance.

one more finding is if u make continuous 8 questions in the begining u have a legacy to do "WRONG : for the next 2 questions and can still maintain 50 levels.

Mid 20 -30 is just a PLAY around. I dont think GMAT really does anything to test u unless u do really really bad.. Once it fixes ur UCL, i must say U CANNOT convince it to raise the bar!!

UCL is fixed within first 20 questions....and dont worry much Lower control limit.... ( U should not bother anyways.)

Bottom line: make her "believe" that u are at 700 levels in the first 10. battle is in the Begining!!


Now tell me, people always say GMAC heavily penalises u for NOT completely finishing the test!! YES i have tested..
IT is true..in my case i got 49 by finishing it and 46 by not finishing it ( i wantedly missed 5 questions in the last)

Simply to put even though u have sword/ sharp dagger in ur quiver, u should first of all have a Opponent /enemy to fight with ..rite??

So first try to make the enemy to come to the arena, then swirl around your sword to slease that MONSTER! & Victory is all yours!![/size]

Hope u got the fine details!! It matters a LOT Aditya!!

Okay,

I can find only one flaw in the reasoning. No one commits mistakes knowingly! Whether that be the 1st question, or the last. Is there a way which can ensure that one does not miss a particular question? All one can do is to prepare in the best possible way.

It is difficult to understand how such strategies work during a test. One is trying to get all answers correct. Can he ensure that he does not miss any of the first 8 questions or not commit 4 consecutive mistakes during the test? No way.

I feel the strategy should be simple. Prepare in the best possible manner. Pay equal attention to every question in the exam. Try to solve within a reasonable time and move on.

This might not be the fanciest of ideas though!

@Adi, Paes and Govi - You can do some kind of simulations with GMAT Prep software. Believe me same software and same algorithm runs in actual test also.

About Quant, if you get easy question and if you finish it in 30 seconds, just wait for 10-15 seconds more. This way software thinks that for easy question you are taking this much time so it will throw you one more easy question. This way you in total 2 easy questions and you are saving your time also. Just try this strategy while giving GMAT Prep exams. (This is not proven method, just do the simulation and try. Hope it works)

Important point not to you 3 but to all who care about how that algorithm works. Tell me one thing, Why to care about how that algorithm works? Our work is to go there and get as many questions correct as possible. Are you guys going to develop that algorithm? No. If you understand that algorithm, will it impact your score? Is GMAC going to throw you any question regarding its scoring algorithm?

So while giving exam leave how algorithm works, just try to get that question correct in 2 minutes.

One more thing, which I always suggest to my friends that try to give GMAT in US rather than in India. GMAT quant is tougher in India than in US.

GMAT quant is similar to CAT quant in India, and CAT quant is horrible :roll:


Disclaimer - this is my personal opinion.

reply2spg wrote:One more thing, which I always suggest to my friends that try to give GMAT in US rather than in India. GMAT quant is tougher in India than in US.

GMAT quant is similar to CAT quant in India, and CAT quant is horrible :roll:


Disclaimer - this is my personal opinion.

@Sudhanshu, I fully acknowledge ur way of telling " Is GMAC going to throw you any question regarding its scoring algorithm? "

Small correction : Our work is to go there and get as many questions correct as possible. Are you guys going to develop that algorithm?

changed Stance :Our work is to go there and get as many TOUGH questions correct as possible. Are you guys going to develop that algorithm?

To get Tough Questions, u neeed to follow a "pattern". To recogonise that pattern u have to "personally" the pattern, which I call as " Decoding the pattern". SO there comes the GMAT simulation.

I fully agree with your timing strategy!! Even that can be a variable!! We can't exclude tat!!

Thx for the inputs!!

niksworth wrote:Okay,

I can find only one flaw in the reasoning. No one commits mistakes knowingly! Whether that be the 1st question, or the last. Is there a way which can ensure that one does not miss a particular question? All one can do is to prepare in the best possible way.

It is difficult to understand how such strategies work during a test. One is trying to get all answers correct. Can he ensure that he does not miss any of the first 8 questions or not commit 4 consecutive mistakes during the test? No way.

I feel the strategy should be simple. Prepare in the best possible manner. Pay equal attention to every question in the exam. Try to solve within a reasonable time and move on.

This might not be the fanciest of ideas though!

@Niks

There is a Logical gap in ur proposal. U said " All one can do is to prepare in the best possible way."

I quoted " even though u have sword/ sharp dagger in ur quiver, u should first of all have a Opponent /enemy to fight with ..rite??

Here is the trick :" No one commits mistakes knowingly"!! But GMAT doesn't understand our emotions. Do u agree with me???

Pardon me but I could not understand how differently do we have to work to achieve our desired goals, keeping in mind your analysis (regarding UCL/LCL, first 8 questions, RC etc.).

Hmmm..
Quite a few experiments done by matchoman...
When i gave gmatprep, used to get first 7 questions right and 8th one was used to be really difficult...
But in actual gmat, the trickiness of the quant did not allow me to settle and get series of questions right!!

@reply2spg..
Giving GMAT in US..Hmmm...I wont mind as I still have a VISA..


@niksworth...
What matchoman meant is even if u have sharp sword, u need to have quality opponent (tough questions to answer), so that even if u sometimes lose, u would not get a high penalty!!

adi_800 wrote:Hmmm..
Quite a few experiments done by matchoman...
When i gave gmatprep, used to get first 7 questions right and 8th one was used to be really difficult...
But in actual gmat, the trickiness of the quant did not allow me to settle and get series of questions right!!

@reply2spg..
Giving GMAT in US..Hmmm...I wont mind as I still have a VISA..


@niksworth...
What matchoman meant is even if u have sharp sword, u need to have quality opponent (tough questions to answer), so that even if u sometimes lose, u would not get a high penalty!!

adi_800:

Did u take GMAT test both in India and in USA? Do you know any one who has taken the test at both India and USA and acheived better results in USA?

I am not sure abt the variation in diffuclty of the exam... so was just curious.

Oh come on, there's no difference between taking GMAT in US or in any other country. It's all inside your head and also due to the large sample of Indians who post their stories here.

GMAT has no reason or incentive to make things harder for any particular group of people, our society in general has already done a good job with that.

As for GMAT not knowing our "psychological level," to be honest, I actually believe they know full well. For example, they probably know that long RC passages scare the crap out of many test takers, regardless the difficulty of the content. Give an average test taker a 5 paragraph passage to read, the fear factor alone will probably ruin rest of the verbal section. Plus if someone isn't familiar with timing and holds strong discipline with knowing when to move on, then he or she will really be in trouble.

GMAT has been doing this for decades, and I believe they know just exactly how to push our button.