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OG 10th Edition Q 140

by Dante » Sat May 31, 2008 9:03 am
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get throughthe harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.


(A) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is
(B) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, is
(C) the collateral which is borrowed against by farmers to get through the harvest season, is
(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

As per OG explination Choice E is best. A,B,C are errors due to the 'is' at the end. However, I felt D is right though it is wordy. The reason is, in case of choice 'E', colleteral refers to declining values where as it should refer to equipment and farm land. Can someone throw some light on how "Declining values as colleteral against ......." is correct.

Thanks for your help
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by jasonc » Sat May 31, 2008 6:38 pm
D doesn't make sense.
in D 'which famers use to...' would mean that declining values is what farmers used as collateral.

in E, collateral correctly modifies farm equipment and land.
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by tanviet » Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:59 am
D is wrong because "against" and "which'should be closed.
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by rey.fernandez » Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:01 pm
In option D, the pronoun "which" correctly modifies "farm equipment and land." The trouble is that it is way too wordy: "use as collateral to borrow against."

In option E, "the collateral against which..." also modifies "farm equipment and land." It's called an appositive... essentially a modifier that is itself a noun. Just like other noun modifiers, an appositive modifies the immediately preceding noun. That's how we know in this case it correctly modifies "farm equipment and land" and NOT "declining values."

FYI, another example of an appositive:

John, a veteran of two wars, now devotes his life to teaching.
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by tanviet » Thu Jun 05, 2008 6:06 am
my friend, pls, read grammar of verb pattern.

when preposition and verb can be separated, "against" should be separated and this is considered more formal. This is main reason why D is wrong.
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Subject verb agreement issue.

by hemanth28 » Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:04 am
Look at the sentence below.I picked the sentence from Manhattan SC 4th edition.

Tracking satellites (is/are) important for the satellite agency.

Can someone tell me how "are" is correct in the case below and not in the case above.

Declining values for farm equipment and land (is/are) going to force the many leaders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

I was under impression that both "Tracking satellites" and "declining values" are gerund phrases and verb should be singular.

Whats wrong in my understanding ?
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by rey.fernandez » Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:56 pm
Let's start with this sentence:
Tracking satellites (is/are) important for the satellite agency.
Here, tracking is acting a gerund -- a verb form that acts as a noun. What is the thing that's important? Tracking. For that reason, the singular verb is is required. Now, the word satellite is acting as the object of the gerund, but the subject of the sentence is nevertheless tracking. We could rewrite the sentence without the object and it still would make sense:

Tracking is important for the satellite agency.

This underscores that tracking really is the subject of the sentence. By adding the word satellite after tracking, we merely are told the object of the activity of tracking. Tracking what? Satellites.

Some other examples:

Eating is fun.
Eating ice cream is fun.
Filming is my favorite activity.
Filming my kids play is my favorite activity.

--

In contrast, the declining values... sentence is markedly different.
Declining values for farm equipment and land (is/are) going to force the many leaders to tighten or deny credit this spring.
Here, although declining looks a lot like tracking, its function is very different. Declining is not a gerund, but instead a modifier. It is describing the word values. Which values? The ones that are declining. As such values is the true subject of the sentence, a plural noun, and so it requires a plural verb, are.

We can rewrite the sentence to see this:

Values for farm equipment and land are going to force the many leaders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

Notice that declining really is just modifying values. We can remove declining and the sentence makes logical sense. Try removing tracking on the sentence above and you wind up with a nonsensical sentence, or at least a sentence whose meaning is very different.

Some other examples:

The concerns drove me to act immediately.
The growing concerns drove me to act immediately.
Stars are a wonderful sight at night.
Shooting stars are a wonderful sight at night.

--

How do you distinguish between these two uses? It depends purely on meaning. For example:

Cooking meals is just one responsibility I have in my new job. [Here cooking is the subject.]
Cooking utensils are 50% off at that store. [Here utensils is the subject.]

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by hemanth28 » Wed Sep 09, 2009 7:28 pm
rey.fernandez wrote:Let's start with this sentence:
Tracking satellites (is/are) important for the satellite agency.
Here, tracking is acting a gerund -- a verb form that acts as a noun. What is the thing that's important? Tracking. For that reason, the singular verb is is required. Now, the word satellite is acting as the object of the gerund, but the subject of the sentence is nevertheless tracking. We could rewrite the sentence without the object and it still would make sense:

Tracking is important for the satellite agency.

This underscores that tracking really is the subject of the sentence. By adding the word satellite after tracking, we merely are told the object of the activity of tracking. Tracking what? Satellites.

Some other examples:

Eating is fun.
Eating ice cream is fun.
Filming is my favorite activity.
Filming my kids play is my favorite activity.

--

In contrast, the declining values... sentence is markedly different.
Declining values for farm equipment and land (is/are) going to force the many leaders to tighten or deny credit this spring.
Here, although declining looks a lot like tracking, its function is very different. Declining is not a gerund, but instead a modifier. It is describing the word values. Which values? The ones that are declining. As such values is the true subject of the sentence, a plural noun, and so it requires a plural verb, are.

We can rewrite the sentence to see this:

Values for farm equipment and land are going to force the many leaders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

Notice that declining really is just modifying values. We can remove declining and the sentence makes logical sense. Try removing tracking on the sentence above and you wind up with a nonsensical sentence, or at least a sentence whose meaning is very different.

Some other examples:

The concerns drove me to act immediately.
The growing concerns drove me to act immediately.
Stars are a wonderful sight at night.
Shooting stars are a wonderful sight at night.

--

How do you distinguish between these two uses? It depends purely on meaning. For example:

Cooking meals is just one responsibility I have in my new job. [Here cooking is the subject.]
Cooking utensils are 50% off at that store. [Here utensils is the subject.]

Rey
Thanks a lot Ray. Now it makes sense totally.
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by bleedthegmat » Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:01 am
rey.fernandez wrote:Let's start with this sentence:
Tracking satellites (is/are) important for the satellite agency.
Here, tracking is acting a gerund -- a verb form that acts as a noun. What is the thing that's important? Tracking. For that reason, the singular verb is is required. Now, the word satellite is acting as the object of the gerund, but the subject of the sentence is nevertheless tracking. We could rewrite the sentence without the object and it still would make sense:

Tracking is important for the satellite agency.

This underscores that tracking really is the subject of the sentence. By adding the word satellite after tracking, we merely are told the object of the activity of tracking. Tracking what? Satellites.

Some other examples:

Eating is fun.
Eating ice cream is fun.
Filming is my favorite activity.
Filming my kids play is my favorite activity.

--

In contrast, the declining values... sentence is markedly different.
Declining values for farm equipment and land (is/are) going to force the many leaders to tighten or deny credit this spring.
Here, although declining looks a lot like tracking, its function is very different. Declining is not a gerund, but instead a modifier. It is describing the word values. Which values? The ones that are declining. As such values is the true subject of the sentence, a plural noun, and so it requires a plural verb, are.

We can rewrite the sentence to see this:

Values for farm equipment and land are going to force the many leaders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

Notice that declining really is just modifying values. We can remove declining and the sentence makes logical sense. Try removing tracking on the sentence above and you wind up with a nonsensical sentence, or at least a sentence whose meaning is very different.

Some other examples:

The concerns drove me to act immediately.
The growing concerns drove me to act immediately.
Stars are a wonderful sight at night.
Shooting stars are a wonderful sight at night.

--

How do you distinguish between these two uses? It depends purely on meaning. For example:

Cooking meals is just one responsibility I have in my new job. [Here cooking is the subject.]
Cooking utensils are 50% off at that store. [Here utensils is the subject.]

Rey
Awesome explanation Ray!!
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by ansumania » Tue Apr 20, 2010 8:47 am
rey.fernandez wrote:In option D, the pronoun "which" correctly modifies "farm equipment and land." The trouble is that it is way too wordy: "use as collateral to borrow against."

In option E, "the collateral against which..." also modifies "farm equipment and land." It's called an appositive... essentially a modifier that is itself a noun. Just like other noun modifiers, an appositive modifies the immediately preceding noun. That's how we know in this case it correctly modifies "farm equipment and land" and NOT "declining values."

FYI, another example of an appositive:

John, a veteran of two wars, now devotes his life to teaching.
rey,

don't we say that the appositives should be separated by commas on both sides as in :John, a veteran of two wars, now devotes his life to teaching.[/quote]

but the one in the question does not follow the same format..
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by magnus opus » Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:23 am
D- has a redundancy issue- use as collateral to borrow-
Since collateral is used to only to borrow against it, stating the purpose using the structure of the infinitive is indeed redundant.
However, "which" here correctly refers to the correct refferent, the one that precedes it ( equip. and land).

E- the modifier "...,collateral...," refers to the entire preceding phrase and hence the adjective "declining" cannot be separated from "values" which seems odd. Moreover "values" can't be the collateral its should be something material.

Can someone please explain this quandry.
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by gmat_perfect » Thu Oct 28, 2010 4:20 am
rey.fernandez wrote:In option D, the pronoun "which" correctly modifies "farm equipment and land." The trouble is that it is way too wordy: "use as collateral to borrow against."

In option E, "the collateral against which..." also modifies "farm equipment and land." It's called an appositive... essentially a modifier that is itself a noun. Just like other noun modifiers, an appositive modifies the immediately preceding noun. That's how we know in this case it correctly modifies "farm equipment and land" and NOT "declining values."

FYI, another example of an appositive:

John, a veteran of two wars, now devotes his life to teaching.
Good point.

Just one point.

See the following sentence:

I have $100, which I use as purchase price to buy a book on economics.

Analyze the boldface part:

We can say either "purchase price" or "to buy", but we should not say both of them at the same time.

Both "purchase price" and "to buy" has the same meaning.

The same deal is in the option D.

Collateral to borrow

Collateral ----> something that is used to borrow.

To borrow--> ??

Now crystal clear.

Thanks.
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by gmat_perfect » Thu Oct 28, 2010 4:30 am
magnus opus wrote: E- the modifier "...,collateral...," refers to the entire preceding phrase and hence the adjective "declining" cannot be separated from "values" which seems odd. Moreover "values" can't be the collateral its should be something material.

Can someone please explain this quandry.
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

Nope,

COMMA + NOUN modifies the NOUN immediately before COMMA.

Example:

I have read the Gitanjoly, Tagore's poem for which Tagore was awarded Nobel prize.

They have made four wheel vehicle, a car which can be driven without fuel.

NOUN1 + COMMA + NOUN2:

--> The NOUN2 is synonymous to NOUN1.

The same deal here.

Farm equipment, the collateral---> Collateral is material, and equipment is material. Values is not material.

So, Collateral clearly refers to Equipment.

Thanks.
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by lunarpower » Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:09 am
magnus opus wrote:D- has a redundancy issue- use as collateral to borrow-
Since collateral is used to only to borrow against it, stating the purpose using the structure of the infinitive is indeed redundant.
However, "which" here correctly refers to the correct refferent, the one that precedes it ( equip. and land).

E- the modifier "...,collateral...," refers to the entire preceding phrase and hence the adjective "declining" cannot be separated from "values" which seems odd. Moreover "values" can't be the collateral its should be something material.

Can someone please explain this quandry.
one real problem with choice (d) is the modifier "to borrow against", which ends with a preposition. modifiers are not allowed to end with prepositions.
this is a very common form in spoken language, but it's incorrect in the written language.
examples:

wrong: "the restaurant (that) we ate at on friday was crowded."
right: "the restaurant at which we ate on friday was crowded."

wrong: "the person joe spoke to yesterday told him that ..."
right: "the person to whom joe spoke yesterday told him that ..."

wrong: "now that i've moved, i need to find a new grocery store to shop at."
right: "now that i've moved, i need to find a new grocery store at which to shop."

you get the point. notice that, in each of these instances, the first version is definitely what native speakers of english would say out loud -- but it's incorrect.
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by martie_11 » Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:31 am
Awesome thread & explanations.

Thanks goes to all contributors.
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