Why most non-natives do not score V40 ?

[AbhiJ]

I am seeing lot of non native speakers after finishing Manhattan SC, Powerscore CR, OG and tests - still stuck in the range of V30-V35 on Verbal and 650 -700 on the GMAT.

It appears that when people start getting SCs and CR correct in a row then they are given a tough lengthy RC which throws them back to sub V35 levels(sub 700 levels).

The reason for may be that reading speed cannot be increased by just practising questions and hence scores tend to stagnate.

Is my reasoning correct.

[throughmba]

Read the posts on this very carefully
https://www.beatthegmat.com/improving-ve ... 22857.html

[Brian@VeritasPrep]

Hey AbhiJ,

Based on my experience on these forums, I'd add this - and I don't think it's necessarily right to paint "non-native speakers" with the broad brush, but I'd certainly say it's true of "most non-native speakers who are active on Beat the GMAT".

The group you mentions tends to thrive on rote memorization, and to do it really well. That's why they'll often write about how many times they've read Manhattan SC or Powerscore CR or how many practice tests they've done. Their emphasis is on "knowing information" and not nearly enough on "how to do GMAT questions". So they:

-Read RC inefficiently, trying to understand most/all of the details in each passage
-Miss big-picture SC errors (illogical meanings, etc.) focusing instead on obscure idioms or plug-and-play strategies
-Struggle with clever CR problems in which their tried-and-true diagramming, etc. strategies don't spit out the correct answer right away (you'll see this a lot with "strengthen" questions that strengthen by introducing a roundabout weakness and then refuting it, or with those that begin with a 12-word out-of-scope modifier before getting to the point)

I'd argue that most of those in the crowd you mention are missing questions because they're focusing their energy on the content knowledge that surrounds the GMAT and not on the higher-order thinking skills that the GMAT truly aims to test. That group also tends to have quite a few students who are so incredibly good at math that they may not have to think too higher-order on quant questions because they can brute-force a lot of it, but on the verbal that's a lot harder to do (if even possible).

Keep in mind that RC passages are capped at a fairly short length (according to OG12 it's 350 words), so it's not a case of the computer trying to wear you down with massively long passages. I'd argue that most of what you're referring to is caused by people's attempts to *know* their way to success on the test and, in doing so, missing the opportunity to *think* their way there.

[AbhiJ]

Brian, what you are saying is correct - V40 is tough for even native speakers.
However i am seeing people who are otherwise good in logic and reasoning skills not able to score more than 670-700. So i was hypothesizing that this is something that is more fundamental which cannot be improved in 3-4 months of GMAT specific prepration. Reading speed could be one such thing.

[David@VeritasPrep]

It certainly is true that taking a test in your 2nd or 3rd language is more difficult than taking it in your first language. However, the people that you mention above who are scoring well on the Quantitative and not as well on the Verbal seems to be an indication to me that strategy is a concern as discussed by Brian Galvin in the above post.

Let me explain: Having worked with many non-native speakers I can say that word problems the Quant section can be just as tough for non-native speakers as the verbal is. I have had students indicate that they cannot complete the section in the time allotted because of trying to understand the word problems. They often miss questions based on misunderstanding as well.

So a student who is able to negotiate the English on Quant word problems should be able to tackle the verbal as well.

Now 40 is a very good score on verbal, it is at or near the 90th percentile. So going over the 90th percentile, while taking the test in a foreign language would not be easy for anyone to do and will require a very good strategy and understanding of what is being tested.

By the way, even a 35 is the 75th percentile, no easy task. Memorization and practice are not enough, understanding what the test is doing and how to think on the test can go along way. For example, when I help my non-native speakers understand what they need to focus on in CR and SC (usually about half of what is written), they find that the Verbal is not as confusing as once thought.

I would even say that some sources out there tend to over complicate things. For example, nothing against PowerScore CR but that book is based on their LSAT book and can at times be more than is needed on the GMAT, even to the point of confusing some people. It is like teaching trigonometry to do GMAT geometry.

What I am saying is that I believe that the verbal can be improved and that reading speed is something that can be overcome. You do not have to be a fast reader to score high on the Verbal - but if you are not a fast reader you better be efficient.

[AbhiJ]

So a student who is able to negotiate the English on Quant word problems should be able to tackle the verbal as well.

Now 40 is a very good score on verbal, it is at or near the 90th percentile. So going over the 90th percentile, while taking the test in a foreign language would not be easy for anyone to do and will require a very good strategy and understanding of what is being tested.

By the way, even a 35 is the 75th percentile, no easy task. Memorization and practice are not enough, understanding what the test is doing and how to think on the test can go along way. For example, when I help my non-native speakers understand what they need to focus on in CR and SC (usually about half of what is written), they find that the Verbal is not as confusing as once thought.

I would even say that some sources out there tend to over complicate things. For example, nothing against PowerScore CR but that book is based on their LSAT book and can at times be more than is needed on the GMAT, even to the point of confusing some people. It is like teaching trigonometry to do GMAT geometry.

What I am saying is that I believe that the verbal can be improved and that reading speed is something that can be overcome. You do not have to be a fast reader to score high on the Verbal - but if you are not a fast reader you better be efficient.

I have not read Veritas Prep CR, but if your post are any indication, it must be pretty good. I especially liked your post about MIPs in CR. Powerscore is a hefty book and for people who have difficulty prioritising the key information when a lot is given - its not the best book.

[prodizy]

Hi Abhi,

I am a non-native speaker, so let me share my experience. When I answer a quant question, I know whether my answer is right or wrong - no two ways about it (a silly mistake could do us in, of course). However, in verbal section, I am never sure of the right answer. Unfortunately for me, all my mock scores in verbal section are excellent and I scored my lowest score ever in the real GMAT. So think like this: when you can answer verbal questions as confidently as you answer the quant questions, you are going towards an AWESOME score.

I think the penalty for getting an easy question wrong is severe in verbal compared to quant. And I think most non-native speakers miss some easy questions hence the low scores.

Another big problem for me in verbal section is the inability to focus. As I don't have to solve a problem literally, I tend to take the verbal questions lightly. I think that did me in.

HTH,
Prodizy

[David@VeritasPrep]

prodizy has made some very good points. A good quant score can be had while missing 12 questions or so on the Quant...people scoring in the high 40s often miss that many. On the verbal there is not as much differentiation so it is necessary to get a higher number of questions right to score well.

So it is important to dig deep and try your best on every verbal question.

It is also true that there is a penalty for missing too many questions at or below your level. This could happen on the verbal more easily than on the quant - say a misunderstood reading passage could result in several questions missed, some of which might be below your overall level.

The big point is the last one that prodizy makes...on verbal there can be that tendency to lose focus at some points. The most important thing that I can recommend is too have a solid technique for every question type.

I lose focus sometimes, too. But I rarely miss verbal questions - I think that this is in large part because my strategy continually re-focuses me. The things that I choose to write down, the techniques that I use are all designed to prevent the loss of focus, or to bring me back if I do lose focus for a minute. Yes I am a native speaker of English and I am sure that helps, but I think that the procedures that I am talking about would be even more important to non-native speakers.

Let me ask some questions:

Do you have a way to check yourself on a reading comp to see if you are understanding the material?

Do you have a procedure to re-focus on the critical reasoning if you get confused or to re-frame the question when you are down to two tough choices?

Do you have a reliable series of steps that allow you to definitely eliminate sentence correction answers for reasons of grammar and logic?

I will not deny that native speakers who were trained properly in English have and advantage. The day the GMAT is offered only in a foreign language I will be in lots of trouble. But the reality is that it is in English for now. So that is why I am trying to help you understand what you can do to try to minimize the advantage that native speakers enjoy.

[voodoo_child]

I lose focus sometimes, too. But I rarely miss verbal questions - I think that this is in large part because my strategy continually re-focuses me. The things that I choose to write down, the techniques that I use are all designed to prevent the loss of focus, or to bring me back if I do lose focus for a minute. Yes I am a native speaker of English and I am sure that helps, but I think that the procedures that I am talking about would be even more important to non-native speakers.

David,
Can you please provide some tips/strategies that you use to prevent loss of focus?

Your help is greatly appreciated!

Thanks
Voodoo

[AbhiJ]

Let me ask some questions:

Do you have a way to check yourself on a reading comp to see if you are understanding the material?

On the tough RCs, i am totally thrown off base. In the given time i find it difficult to truly comprehend the passages - which leads to re-reading and rushing on questions. I can read passages in 4 mins but tend to take more than 1 minute answering a question on average.

During the GMAT Prep haven't read non fictions and hope reading a few will bring back the concentration continuity.

Do you have a procedure to re-focus on the critical reasoning if you get confused or to re-frame the question when you are down to two tough choices?

Have a strategy for every question. However when stuck with 2 tough choices go with one that appears better. This happens on around 20% of CR questions.

Do you have a reliable series of steps that allow you to definitely eliminate sentence correction answers for reasons of grammar and logic?

On SC, first look for the 5/6 basic errors and then go by concision and clarity.

Thanks David for the informative post.

[sunman]

I am seeing lot of non native speakers after finishing Manhattan SC, Powerscore CR, OG and tests - still stuck in the range of V30-V35 on Verbal and 650 -700 on the GMAT.

It appears that when people start getting SCs and CR correct in a row then they are given a tough lengthy RC which throws them back to sub V35 levels(sub 700 levels).

The reason for may be that reading speed cannot be increased by just practising questions and hence scores tend to stagnate.

Is my reasoning correct.

It's alright, because you guys kick our butts in quant, so you make up for it.

I got a 46 on quant...there's no reason that should reflect a 73rd percentile. Y'all are busting the curve.