680 (43 Q; 40 V): should i take it again given my profile?

[chiquitothecat]

Fellow beathegmatters,
I would like your opinions of my chances of admission into a top 10 business school and the JD/MBA 3 yr program at Northwestern/Kellogg. Your help is appreciated. I have worked in nonprofit out of college and recently took my first job at small public company. I want to pursue an MBA or JD/MBA to make a complete career jump from nonprofit/govt. I am interested in finance or general mgt as a focus. I provided my profile info below. Your guidance is appreciated.

GMAT:
I just took the GMAT and scored 680 (Q43: V40). I am contemplating taking the GMAT again since I am in a "gray area" and only 70th pct in quant, but I would like your opinions before considering a retake any further. I am also considering taking an evening financial analysis/accounting class to show i'm serious about improving my quant.

Academics:
I went to a top 50 college where I was phi beta kappa, valedictorian of my class and I received other awards for leadership. I graduated with a 3.92 GPA in a double major and a minor--all in liberal arts/social sciences disciplines.

Experience:
After college I served with Americorps (1 year) and afterwards participated in a prestigious leadership/public affairs fellowship (1 year). I currently work in financial media (>1 year, my first job in the private sector). I have been out of college for 3-4 years.

Extracurriculars:
-(4 years) Fraternity alumni corporation of the local chapter of my fraternity and a regular volunteer for the national fraternity at conferences
-(3 years) The alumni board of my americorps program: I hold a leadership position
-(>2 years) volunteer in the St. Vincent Depaul society of my church
-(<1 year) Recently joined a team of young professionals to start from scratch another non profit alumni board

Personal:
I am an ethnic minority. My parents are immigrants. I grew up in the South.

[TkNeo]

Kellogg puts a lot of emphasis on WE...so you should make sure you have quality work experience.. What year/session/program at kellogg are you applying for ?


As far as your GMAT is concerned i don't think it will make a difference unless you get a 750.... your GPA is pretty high which shows u r good at acads.. High GMAT would just confirm that but nothing else...

[faraji13]

If you were a 3rd yr. Analyst at Lehman who did nothing in their spare time, maybe you'd want to retake, but given your diversified work experience and outside interests coupled with your GPA, I'd agree with TKNEO: I don't think it changes the calculus that much, but your best bet would be to just ask the admissions folks.

[stock2007]

why the jd/mba at kellog?

do you really want to do a JD/MBA and that too a super condensed three year one?

ask yourself? what do you see yourself doing with this degree ten years from now?

will it be useful? is it neccessary?

alot of my friends did the jd/mba.

your score is pretty good.

have faith.

[faraji13]

A friend of mine did his JD at Columbia then MBA at Northwestern. Worked at Citibank for a year or two, saw his health and quality of life vanish,and eventually quit.

[stock2007]

In my opnion,

the J.D/MBA is a waste of your talent. ( based on your future goals )

1) Too many attorneys exist in the market place.
2) Too many law school graduates coming out law schools today.
3) You have to work way too hard like a decade to make partner. If your lucky and you work hard, you can make that same cash in your second year after mba, if you get a good gig and bonus.
4) In the future it is possible that due to the nature of globalisation, the grunt, clerical lawyer work needed of beginning players at law firms will be outsourced to somewhere abroad, who will work for 1/7th your hourly rate.
5) If the legislatures continue to cap trial cases judgements. Forget about the millions that way.
6) You can always hire an attorney for 300 to 500 bucks an hour. You dont need to know the book to get the job done. Even on a stretch, hollywood divorce lawyers will charge 700$ an hour tops and if your fighting enron kinda trials, put it at 1000$ an hour.
7) Most law school graduates today, even the ones who graduate from top schools, unless their one of those stars.. max out at their average to medium size firms, or as judges, mediators, professors, in the 200 grand a year range.
8) You will have many sleepless nights for the first 10 years if you work as in in house counsel for any major fortune 500 firm and you will have even more sleepless nights, if you work for a major law firm right out of college. For the amount you get paid for that, i would recommend i banking anyday of the week. you can retire in a decade with that if you work hard.
9) The J.D - MBA degree is weak, in the sense, from the mba standpoint, their two different academic approaches, from the law school perspective your working "in" the business, from the mba perspective your working "on" the business. If your going to be a star, entrpreneuer manager, you want to train to think broadly on the business, not in the business.
10) the Jd-mba, really does not let you take many electives in the b-school, its rigid, ull end up finishing all the law school requirements, with very little options to take and truly specialise and accomplish mastery in a functional business discpline at b-school, as you may have done if you did a tradtional mba.
11) lawyers dont get respect, until some one needs them.
12) the JD/MBA will cost you 200 grand. at any top school, 50 grand a year, for four years. even at kellog, ull have to take a summer, so put it at 200 grand out of pocket,.
13) When you interview at the Law firm, they will look at your resume with suspect, with the fear, that this guy has an mba, he may not be long term with us, he may leave.. it will be tough explaining your comittmenet to the law profession
14) When you apply to post b school jobs, they will look at you with suspect, as to why you did a law degree, and doubt you as well.
15) You will have to become a multi-purpose machine within a company if you intend to work in both management and law within your company.
16) Let others do the grunt work when it comest to legal work. Cuz, unless you are a practicing attorney in that field, the nuances, the current trials and tribulations, the trends, will not be with you, and even though you have a law degree, you may not completely be able to rely on your legal acumen unless your practicing and upto date, with revisions and changes in the system, you cannot manage and pretend to keep up with the law. it is hard.
17) if you become legal counsel, forget managing. ur duty wll be to become the due dligence animal of your firm. no management authority or promotion. The case of Charles Prince at Citigroup was an exception.
18) To get into any other of the top jd-mba programs, not only will you have to crack your gmat, you will have to get a stellar lsat score of 167 or more.
19) With the dollar deprication, the legal salaries and perks do not mean that much these days. By the time ull be making real dough, unless ur a star is when your 50 years old, have completed thousands of cases, practicing for more than 2 decades, ur old and you have gray hair.
20) In pure management, and based on your talent, either in ibanking or silicon valley or other industries, u have more hope to make it sooner.
21) Do you like to read. It may sound easy right now. But the reading in law school is a beast. You will read and read and read , till you pass out. If you cant handle that. forget about three years and thousands of pages of lenghy dense readings.

Lastly, i presumed alot, if your goal is to beocme a pro bono lawyer working for the innocence project or to work for ngo's stretching from human rights violations on immigration to international human rights issues.. on the GMAT trade and wars.. then sure, if your goals in that sense are altruistic and you have a real passion for the law. and you have family legacy and bond or something.. J.D is cool.

otherwise its a waste.

good luck

[chiquitothecat]

I have friends who are associates in both big lawfirms and ibanks and life looks miserable for them but they are making a lot of money. Ultimately, i feel because of my personality and creativity I will move in the direction of venture capital. After looting the private sector and building sufficient capital (money and contacts) i will start my own foundation in which I will either manage the endowment or the operations. I feel both degrees will provide me with the knowledge and skills needed to manage all aspects well.