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OGV #18

by mundasingh123 » Sun Jun 19, 2011 5:31 am
Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged in 1911，Scott Joplin's ragtime opera＂Treemonisha＂was not produced　until 1972，sixty-one years after its completion．
(A) Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged
(B) Except for a concert performance with the composer himself staging it
(C) Besides a concert performance being staged by the composer himself
(D) Excepting a concert performance that the composer himself staged
(E) With the exception of a concert performance with the staging done by the composer himself.

Could an Expert please tell if the opening modifier"Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged in 1911" is a verb modifier or a noun modifier ?

If a noun modifier than which noun does it modify ?
If a verb modifer , then which verb, how does it modify the verb ?
Why is nt Besides correct here ? Is Besides a noun modifier ?

How to eliminate the other options here ?
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by Geva@EconomistGMAT » Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:01 am
mundasingh123 wrote:Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged in 1911，Scott Joplin's ragtime opera＂Treemonisha＂was not produced　until 1972，sixty-one years after its completion．
(A) Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged
(B) Except for a concert performance with the composer himself staging it
(C) Besides a concert performance being staged by the composer himself
(D) Excepting a concert performance that the composer himself staged
(E) With the exception of a concert performance with the staging done by the composer himself.

Could an Expert please tell if the opening modifier"Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged in 1911" is a verb modifier or a noun modifier ?

If a noun modifier than which noun does it modify ?
If a verb modifer , then which verb, how does it modify the verb ?
Why is nt Besides correct here ? Is Besides a noun modifier ?

How to eliminate the other options here ?
All I'm really seeing here are stylistic issues, rather than grammar ones: At the end of the day, A is chosen not necessarily because B, C, D and E are WRONG per se, but because A is simply the most effective choice.

B has unnecessary use of pronouns.
C is fine with the use of besides, but less preferable for the stylistic awkwardness of using "being staged".
D unnecessary use of Excepting.
E Unnecessarily long with "with the exception" "with the staging"
Last edited by Geva@EconomistGMAT on Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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by ov25 » Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:02 am
Consider this...

except my work, all paintings were graded at the exhibition.

using 'except' qualifies the noun 'all paintings'. Similarly in the sentence, the gist would be..

except one stage show, the opera was not produce

I think its easier to visualize this way
------------
Part B - besides....being

I don't think 'besides' is a problem in itself. However the usage of 'being' might. For one, it suggests the 'a concert performance' is currently staged (present participle). Two, even if you want to suggest it does, consider this
'Besides himself staging a concert performance, SJ's ragtime opera "T"....'
you might agree that it is more concise.

my .02
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by akhpad » Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:49 am
Geva@MasterGMAT wrote:
All I'm really seeing here are stylistic issues, rather than grammar ones: At the end of the day, A is chosen not necessarily because B, C, D and E are WRONG per se, but because A is simply the most effective choice.

B has unnecessary use of pronouns.
C is fine with the use of besides, but less preferable for the stylistic awkwardness of using "being staged".
D unnecessary use of Excepting.
E Unnecessarily long with "with the exception" "with the staging"
Can you please explain that why D is wrong and A is best than others?
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by aspirant2011 » Tue Aug 16, 2011 7:13 am
akhpad wrote:
Geva@MasterGMAT wrote:
All I'm really seeing here are stylistic issues, rather than grammar ones: At the end of the day, A is chosen not necessarily because B, C, D and E are WRONG per se, but because A is simply the most effective choice.

B has unnecessary use of pronouns.
C is fine with the use of besides, but less preferable for the stylistic awkwardness of using "being staged".
D unnecessary use of Excepting.
E Unnecessarily long with "with the exception" "with the staging"
Can you please explain that why D is wrong and A is best than others?
because excepting is a wrong word and I doubt that there exists such word also ..........
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by akhpad » Tue Aug 16, 2011 7:29 am
aspirant2011 wrote: because excepting is a wrong word and I doubt that there exists such word also ..........
But OE does not seem to be in such way.
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by mundasingh123 » Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:31 pm
ov25 wrote:Consider this...

except my work, all paintings were graded at the exhibition.

using 'except' qualifies the noun 'all paintings'. Similarly in the sentence, the gist would be..

except one stage show, the opera was not produce

I think its easier to visualize this way
------------
Part B - besides....being

I don't think 'besides' is a problem in itself. However the usage of 'being' might. For one, it suggests the 'a concert performance' is currently staged (present participle). Two, even if you want to suggest it does, consider this
'Besides himself staging a concert performance, SJ's ragtime opera "T"....'
you might agree that it is more concise.

my .02
Geva , What do you think about this ?
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by lunarpower » Thu Aug 25, 2011 2:40 am
akhpad wrote:Can you please explain that why D is wrong and A is best than others?
(d) is incorrect because of a unique idiomatic construction that you will almost certainly never see in an official problem again. specifically, "excepting" is used to preface negative exceptions to positive statements.

for instance,

excepting a few bits of dialogue, nothing in the text is understandable --> not ok, because "excepting" is used to preface a positive exception (things that are understandable) to a negative statement (everything else is not understandable).

excepting some of the dialogue, everything in the play is beautifully written --> this would be acceptable.

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i would bet good money that this distinction will never show up on an official problem again; therefore, on an importance scale of 0 to 10, this one is at 0.
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by Onell » Sun Nov 13, 2011 8:09 pm
Geva@MasterGMAT wrote:
mundasingh123 wrote:Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged in 1911，Scott Joplin's ragtime opera＂Treemonisha＂was not produced　until 1972，sixty-one years after its completion．
(A) Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged
(B) Except for a concert performance with the composer himself staging it
(C) Besides a concert performance being staged by the composer himself
(D) Excepting a concert performance that the composer himself staged
(E) With the exception of a concert performance with the staging done by the composer himself.

Could an Expert please tell if the opening modifier"Except for a concert performance that the composer himself staged in 1911" is a verb modifier or a noun modifier ?

If a noun modifier than which noun does it modify ?
If a verb modifer , then which verb, how does it modify the verb ?
Why is nt Besides correct here ? Is Besides a noun modifier ?

How to eliminate the other options here ?
All I'm really seeing here are stylistic issues, rather than grammar ones: At the end of the day, A is chosen not necessarily because B, C, D and E are WRONG per se, but because A is simply the most effective choice.

B has unnecessary use of pronouns.
C is fine with the use of besides, but less preferable for the stylistic awkwardness of using "being staged".
D unnecessary use of Excepting.
E Unnecessarily long with "with the exception" "with the staging"

Hi Geva,

Can we eliminate the option B and C for using present participle? My understanding is that present participle shows action occurring at the same time as that of the verb.Therefore the sentence illogically suggests that staging is still going on. Please comment
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by ankur_2710 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 2:19 pm
Hi Lunarpower,

I have a confusion in the usage of "excepting".

In the post below you have mentioned "excepting" is used to preface negative exceptions to positive statements.

But pls check this link (https://www.manhattanprep.com/gmat/foru ... 11583.html)
Here Ron replies - it is generally only used in introducing an exception to a negative statement, i.e., a statement originally phrased with not, don't, nobody, etc.

Both are contradictory statements... could you please confirm which usage is correct.



lunarpower wrote:
akhpad wrote:Can you please explain that why D is wrong and A is best than others?
(d) is incorrect because of a unique idiomatic construction that you will almost certainly never see in an official problem again. specifically, "excepting" is used to preface negative exceptions to positive statements.

for instance,

excepting a few bits of dialogue, nothing in the text is understandable --> not ok, because "excepting" is used to preface a positive exception (things that are understandable) to a negative statement (everything else is not understandable).

excepting some of the dialogue, everything in the play is beautifully written --> this would be acceptable.

--

i would bet good money that this distinction will never show up on an official problem again; therefore, on an importance scale of 0 to 10, this one is at 0.
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by victory » Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:22 am
there is no "excepting" as a preposition in the dictionary.

end of story.

am i correct
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