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by bryan88 » Wed Apr 25, 2012 6:28 pm
The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being so far away from Earth that their apparent positions in the sky do not change enough for their movement to be observed during a single human lifetime.

(A) The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being
(B) Like the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(C) Although like the planets the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, yet
(D) As the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(E) The stars are in motion like the planets, some of which at tremendous speeds are in motion but

Is "them" in B correct?
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by GMATGuruNY » Wed Apr 25, 2012 6:48 pm
bryan88 wrote:The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being so far away from Earth that their apparent positions in the sky do not change enough for their movement to be observed during a single human lifetime.

(A) The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being
(B) Like the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(C) Although like the planets the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, yet
(D) As the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(E) The stars are in motion like the planets, some of which at tremendous speeds are in motion but

Is "them" in B correct?
In B, them clearly refers to stars (the nearest preceding plural noun and the subject of the sentence).
The entire phrase some of them at tremendous speeds is an ABSOLUTE PHRASE modifying the preceding clause.
For the definition of an absolute phrase, please check my post here:

https://www.beatthegmat.com/modifier-mis ... 37-15.html
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by confuse mind » Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:43 pm
GMATGuruNY wrote:
bryan88 wrote:The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being so far away from Earth that their apparent positions in the sky do not change enough for their movement to be observed during a single human lifetime.

(A) The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being
(B) Like the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(C) Although like the planets the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, yet
(D) As the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(E) The stars are in motion like the planets, some of which at tremendous speeds are in motion but

Is "them" in B correct?
In B, them clearly refers to stars (the nearest preceding plural noun and the subject of the sentence).
The entire phrase some of them at tremendous speeds is an ABSOLUTE PHRASE modifying the preceding clause.
For the definition of an absolute phrase, please check my post here:

https://www.beatthegmat.com/modifier-mis ... 37-15.html


I have 3 queries in the above question and B in particular

* I feel 'some of them' modifies stars so shouldn't the correct formation be:

(B) Like the planets, the stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion but they are

* shouldn't 'them' be replaced by which

* Like we three forms for 'who', namely, who whom whose, what are corresponding forms for which/that
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by arunima88 » Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:57 pm
Some people adhere to a rule that says in effect use "that" for restrictive relative clauses and "which" for non-restrictive relative clauses. A good discussion of this topic can be found here .

My own personal belief is that this rule has been relaxed over time. Now you can use "that" and "which" much more interchangably with restrictive and non-restrictive relative clauses. But some still rigourously adhere to this rule.

I hope that helps.
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by GMATGuruNY » Fri Apr 27, 2012 4:08 am
confuse mind wrote:
GMATGuruNY wrote:
bryan88 wrote:The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being so far away from Earth that their apparent positions in the sky do not change enough for their movement to be observed during a single human lifetime.

(A) The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being
(B) Like the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(C) Although like the planets the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, yet
(D) As the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(E) The stars are in motion like the planets, some of which at tremendous speeds are in motion but

Is "them" in B correct?
In B, them clearly refers to stars (the nearest preceding plural noun and the subject of the sentence).
The entire phrase some of them at tremendous speeds is an ABSOLUTE PHRASE modifying the preceding clause.
For the definition of an absolute phrase, please check my post here:

https://www.beatthegmat.com/modifier-mis ... 37-15.html


I have 3 queries in the above question and B in particular

* I feel 'some of them' modifies stars so shouldn't the correct formation be:

(B) Like the planets, the stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion but they are

* shouldn't 'them' be replaced by which

* Like we three forms for 'who', namely, who whom whose, what are corresponding forms for which/that
SOME OF WHICH and SOME OF THEM serve different purposes.

SOME OF WHICH serves to modify a NOUN and requires its own verb:
The stars, SOME OF WHICH travel at tremendous speeds, are always in motion.
The modifying clause here (some of which travel at tremendous speeds) tells us more about the STARS themselves.

SOME OF THEM serves to modify a CLAUSE and is NOT provided its own verb:
The stars are always in motion, SOME OF THEM at tremendous speeds.
Here, the modifying phrase (some of them at tremendous speeds) tells us more not about the stars themselves but about HOW the stars are ALWAYS IN MOTION (they are in motion AT TREMENDOUS SPEEDS).

In short:
QUANTIFIER + OF + WHICH + VERB modifies a NOUN.
QUANTIFIER + OF + THEM + NO VERB modifies a CLAUSE.

For another example, please check the following SC from GMATPrep:

https://www.beatthegmat.com/plz-help-thi ... 07322.html
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by GmatKiss » Fri Apr 27, 2012 4:45 am
The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being so far away from Earth that their apparent positions in the sky do not change enough for their movement to be observed during a single human lifetime.

(A) The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being
(B) Like the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are - change in meaning
(C) Although like the planets the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, yet
(D) As the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(E) The stars are in motion like the planets, some of which at tremendous speeds are in motion but

Please underline the question.

IMO: A
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by ice_rush » Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:15 am
(B) is the clear winner here.
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by RBBmba@2014 » Sun Jul 26, 2015 10:26 am
GMATGuruNY wrote: In short:
QUANTIFIER + OF + WHICH + VERB modifies a NOUN.
QUANTIFIER + OF + THEM + NO VERB modifies a CLAUSE.
Hi GMATGuruNY - do the above TWO aspects ALWAYS hold good on GMAT ? (Can there be any EXCEPTIONS as far as GMAT is concerned ?)
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by GMATGuruNY » Mon Jul 27, 2015 5:21 am
RBBmba@2014 wrote:
GMATGuruNY wrote: In short:
QUANTIFIER + OF + WHICH + VERB modifies a NOUN.
QUANTIFIER + OF + THEM + NO VERB modifies a CLAUSE.
Hi GMATGuruNY - do the above TWO aspects ALWAYS hold good on GMAT ? (Can there be any EXCEPTIONS as far as GMAT is concerned ?)
The rule above should always hold true.
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by thang » Sun Aug 16, 2015 3:17 am
bryan88 wrote:The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being so far away from Earth that their apparent positions in the sky do not change enough for their movement to be observed during a single human lifetime.

(A) The stars, some of them at tremendous speeds, are in motion just as the planets are, yet being
(B) Like the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(C) Although like the planets the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, yet
(D) As the planets, the stars are in motion, some of them at tremendous speeds, but they are
(E) The stars are in motion like the planets, some of which at tremendous speeds are in motion but

Is "them" in B correct?
I think E is hardest to eliminate.
E means
some of the planets at tremendous speeds are in motion. so , not all planets at tremendous speed are is motion. illogic

very hard to realize this time , harder in the test room.
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by Mo2men » Thu Feb 04, 2016 7:11 am
GMATGuruNY wrote:
RBBmba@2014 wrote:
GMATGuruNY wrote: In short:
QUANTIFIER + OF + WHICH + VERB modifies a NOUN.
QUANTIFIER + OF + THEM + NO VERB modifies a CLAUSE.
Hi GMATGuruNY - do the above TWO aspects ALWAYS hold good on GMAT ? (Can there be any EXCEPTIONS as far as GMAT is concerned ?)
The rule above should always hold true.

Hi Guru,

The correct answer (B) contains pronoun 'they'. but to which 'they' refer? it is unclear. Can I apply any test to be sure

thanks
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by GMATGuruNY » Thu Feb 04, 2016 4:19 pm
Mo2men wrote:Hi Guru,

The correct answer (B) contains pronoun 'they'. but to which 'they' refer? it is unclear. Can I apply any test to be sure

thanks
The default referent for a subject pronoun is the PRECEDING SUBJECT.
In B, they (subject pronoun) serves to refer to the stars (the preceding subject).

Also:
In most cases, forms of the same pronoun will have the same referent.
The third person plural pronouns are as follows:
they, them, their, theirs.
In B, them and they -- forms of the third person plural -- both serve to refer to the stars.
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by Mo2men » Fri Feb 05, 2016 3:59 am
GMATGuruNY wrote:
Mo2men wrote:Hi Guru,

The correct answer (B) contains pronoun 'they'. but to which 'they' refer? it is unclear. Can I apply any test to be sure

thanks
The default referent for a subject pronoun is the PRECEDING SUBJECT.
In B, they (subject pronoun) serves to refer to the stars (the preceding subject).

Also:
In most cases, forms of the same pronoun will have the same referent.
The third person plural pronouns are as follows:
they, them, their, theirs.
In B, them and they -- forms of the third person plural -- both serve to refer to the stars.
Thanks for your great explanation.

What if the pronoun is in object form (it, him, her, them) without any clear antecedent.I hope following example conveys the intended meaning of my question.

Cats prey on mice. However, people love them.

Can I suggest from meaning that that people love mice?
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by GMATGuruNY » Fri Feb 05, 2016 5:41 am
Mo2men wrote: Thanks for your great explanation.

What if the pronoun is in object form (it, him, her, them) without any clear antecedent.I hope following example conveys the intended meaning of my question.

Cats prey on mice. However, people love them.

Can I suggest from meaning that that people love mice?
Incorrect: Cats prey on mice, but people love them.
Here, them could logically serve to refer to cats or to mice, as follows:
Cats prey on mice, but people love cats.
Cats prey on mice, but people love mice.
Thus, the sentence above is not viable.

If an answer choice seems to allow for more than one logical interpretation, look for an answer choice that makes the intended meaning crystal clear.
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