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Rhetorical Construction; Diction

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Rhetorical Construction; Diction

by gmattesttaker2 » Wed Aug 15, 2012 11:22 pm
Hello,

This is from OG. 13. I am not clear with explanation for the correct answer. Can you please help?

D35) By 1940, the pilot Jacqueline Cochran held seventeen official national and international speed records, and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be of dangerously experimental design.

A) and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
B) earning them at a time that aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
C) earning these at a time where aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were
D) earned at a time in which aviation was still so new such that many of the planes she flew were
E) earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were

OA is E

Thanks a lot.

Best Regards,
Sri
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by patanjali.purpose » Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:03 am
gmattesttaker2 wrote:Hello,

This is from OG. 13. I am not clear with explanation for the correct answer. Can you please help?

D35) By 1940, the pilot Jacqueline Cochran held seventeen official national and international speed records, and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be of dangerously experimental design.

A) and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
B) earning them at a time that aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
C) earning these at a time where aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were
D) earned at a time in which aviation was still so new such that many of the planes she flew were
E) earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were

OA is E

Thanks a lot.

Best Regards,
Sri
HOLDING (of national and international) RECORDS and EARNING THEM are not two separate activities. In fact, EARNING THEM... is a modifier of the "HOLDING ..RECORDS", meaning MODIFIER "EARNING THEM...DESIGN" giving additional information about Cochran's holding of several records. Drop A

TO BE implies design was not dangerous at that time, but it was to become dangerous sometime in future. So we can drop A/B (we require PAST TENSE)

C - use of THESE wrong (A NOUN should follow THESE, such as THESE BOOKS)

D - use of SO..SUCH..THAT (use of SUCH is not correct).

Another point, EARNING is the after effect of HOLDING ...RECORDS and therefore, use of EARNING is not appropriate, we need to use EARNED. From this we can drop B/C directly.

IMO E
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by gmattesttaker2 » Thu Aug 16, 2012 10:03 pm
patanjali.purpose wrote:
gmattesttaker2 wrote:Hello,

This is from OG. 13. I am not clear with explanation for the correct answer. Can you please help?

D35) By 1940, the pilot Jacqueline Cochran held seventeen official national and international speed records, and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be of dangerously experimental design.

A) and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
B) earning them at a time that aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
C) earning these at a time where aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were
D) earned at a time in which aviation was still so new such that many of the planes she flew were
E) earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were

OA is E

Thanks a lot.

Best Regards,
Sri
HOLDING (of national and international) RECORDS and EARNING THEM are not two separate activities. In fact, EARNING THEM... is a modifier of the "HOLDING ..RECORDS", meaning MODIFIER "EARNING THEM...DESIGN" giving additional information about Cochran's holding of several records. Drop A

TO BE implies design was not dangerous at that time, but it was to become dangerous sometime in future. So we can drop A/B (we require PAST TENSE)

C - use of THESE wrong (A NOUN should follow THESE, such as THESE BOOKS)

D - use of SO..SUCH..THAT (use of SUCH is not correct).

Another point, EARNING is the after effect of HOLDING ...RECORDS and therefore, use of EARNING is not appropriate, we need to use EARNED. From this we can drop B/C directly.

IMO E
Hello,

Thanks for your reply. The book explanation seems to be saying that for B and C "earning" is close to "records" and hence B and C can be eliminated. However, even in E "earned" is close to "records". I was just wondering why it is different for E? Thanks again.

Best Regards,
Sri
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by Patrick_GMATFix » Fri Aug 17, 2012 7:21 am
Hi Sri,

I don't have a problem with "earning"; it can introduce a modifier that gives additional information about the preceding clause. I'm not sure why the official explanation doesn't like "earning" because I don't understand the justification given.

My problem with C is the use of "where" to refer to "a time". My problem with D is the use of "in which" to refer to "a time" and the presence of "such" in "so X such that..."

What I can say however is that if the author wishes for the underlined portion to describe records specifically, 'earning' is not well suited because -ing introduced modifiers that follow a comma typically modify the entire preceding clause or the subject at the head of that clause. To modify the noun just before the comma (ie "records"), the modifier should begin with a relative pronoun (ie "which were earned at a time..."), a noun (ie "a feat accomplished at a time...") or an adjective/past partiple ("earned at a time...")

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by gmattesttaker2 » Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:19 pm
Patrick_GMATFix wrote:Hi Sri,

I don't have a problem with "earning"; it can introduce a modifier that gives additional information about the preceding clause. I'm not sure why the official explanation doesn't like "earning" because I don't understand the justification given.

My problem with C is the use of "where" to refer to "a time". My problem with D is the use of "in which" to refer to "a time" and the presence of "such" in "so X such that..."

What I can say however is that if the author wishes for the underlined portion to describe records specifically, 'earning' is not well suited because -ing introduced modifiers that follow a comma typically modify the entire preceding clause or the subject at the head of that clause. To modify the noun just before the comma (ie "records"), the modifier should begin with a relative pronoun (ie "which were earned at a time..."), a noun (ie "a feat accomplished at a time...") or an adjective/past partiple ("earned at a time...")

-Patrick
Hello Patrick,

Thank you very much for your explanation. It is a lot clearer now. Thanks again for your help.

Best Regards,
Sri
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by 7777 » Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:13 am
gmattesttaker2 wrote:Hello,

This is from OG. 13. I am not clear with explanation for the correct answer. Can you please help?

D35) By 1940, the pilot Jacqueline Cochran held seventeen official national and international speed records, and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be of dangerously experimental design.

A) and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
B) earning them at a time that aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
C) earning these at a time where aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were
D) earned at a time in which aviation was still so new such that many of the planes she flew were
E) earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were

OA is E


Thanks a lot.

Best Regards,

Sri

A) and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be(this sentence needs not to be written in two different clauses.)
B) earning them at a time that aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be("time that aviation " not good. comma + verbing suggests that earning happened as a result of holding. it seems illogical to me)
C) earning these at a time where aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were("time where" not good. previous "earning" rule applies here too though)
D) earned at a time in which aviation was still so new such that many of the planes she flew were
E) earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were(preferred over option D. it modifies the preceding noun "records.")


i don't remember very correctly but in the manhattan sc guide,i think it was written that present participle with comma acts as a VERB modifier;however, present participle without commas is used for modifying a noun.
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by richachampion » Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:48 pm
Patrick_GMATFix wrote:Hi Sri,

I don't have a problem with "earning"; it can introduce a modifier that gives additional information about the preceding clause. I'm not sure why the official explanation doesn't like "earning" because I don't understand the justification given.

My problem with C is the use of "where" to refer to "a time". My problem with D is the use of "in which" to refer to "a time" and the presence of "such" in "so X such that..."

What I can say however is that if the author wishes for the underlined portion to describe records specifically, 'earning' is not well suited because -ing introduced modifiers that follow a comma typically modify the entire preceding clause or the subject at the head of that clause. To modify the noun just before the comma (ie "records"), the modifier should begin with a relative pronoun (ie "which were earned at a time..."), a noun (ie "a feat accomplished at a time...") or an adjective/past partiple ("earned at a time...")

-Patrick
Words of Wisdom from Mr. Purewal -

When you use a COMMA -ING modifier after a clause**, you should actually satisfy TWO requirements:

1. the modifier should modify the action of the preceding clause;
2. The subject of the preceding clause should also make sense as the agent of the -ING action.

This sort of modifier should additionally satisfy TWO requirements:

1) It should apply most nearly to the subject of the preceding clause (as you've said); and, even more importantly,
2) It should have one of the following RELATIONSHIPS to that clause:
* Immediate consequence
* Simultaneous, but lower-priority, action

VERB + Ing Modifiers also take the tense of the Preceding clause.


If you have noun +, + __ing, then the __ing describes that initial noun. I.e., if there are other nouns in modifier(s) attached to that noun, then comma + __ing DOES NOT describe those closer nouns.

e.g.,
The father of the two boys, arriving at the courthouse, was xxxxx.
--> This sentence unambiguously states that the father was arriving at the courthouse.
It's important that the construction work this way, because there aren't very many other modifiers with similar functionality.


On the other hand verb + ed modifier modifies the nearest noun correctly here i.e. records.
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by zoe » Tue Aug 30, 2016 11:19 pm
Hi instructors,

anyone can help to clarify that "that" modifies "a time" is correct in B?

thanks a lot
have a nice day

>_~
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by richachampion » Tue Aug 30, 2016 11:23 pm
zoe wrote:Hi instructors,

anyone can help to clarify that "that" modifies "a time" is correct in B?

thanks a lot
have a nice day

>_~
Zoe,

That and where both are incorrect. when, which is correctly used in option A and Option E, would be correct to refer to time.
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by prabsahi » Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:13 am
gmattesttaker2 wrote:Hello,

This is from OG. 13. I am not clear with explanation for the correct answer. Can you please help?

D35) By 1940, the pilot Jacqueline Cochran held seventeen official national and international speed records, and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be of dangerously experimental design.

A) and she earned them at a time when aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
B) earning them at a time that aviation was still so new for many of the planes she flew to be
C) earning these at a time where aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were
D) earned at a time in which aviation was still so new such that many of the planes she flew were
E) earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were

OA is E

Thanks a lot.

Best Regards,
Sri

Please help me clarify the below point.

Isn't EARNED --in option E used as a VERB and not VERB-ed modifier.

Reason--It makes sense with the subject of preceding clause.

If so then it doesnt modify the speed records and because it would require a dedicated subject.

Confused please help.
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by GMATGuruNY » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:15 am
prabsahi wrote:Please help me clarify the below point.

Isn't EARNED --in option E used as a VERB and not VERB-ed modifier.

Reason--It makes sense with the subject of preceding clause.

If so then it doesnt modify the speed records and because it would require a dedicated subject.

Confused please help.
A DIRECT OBJECT is a noun or noun phrase that RECEIVES the action of the verb.
John hit the ball.
Here, the ball serves as the direct object of hit.

A TRANSITIVE verb is a verb that must take a direct object.
earn is a transitive verb.
Incorrect: Mary earned.
The sentence above does not express a complete thought.
For the sentence to be complete, a direct object is required:
Correct: Mary earned millions.
Here, millions serves as the direct object of earned.

OA: By 1940, the pilot Jacqueline Cochran held seventeen official national and international speed records, earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were of dangerously experimental design.
Here, earned is not followed by a direct object and thus cannot be serving as a verb.
The only possible interpretation is that earned is an ADJECTIVE describing the preceding noun (speed records).
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by prabsahi » Thu Mar 30, 2017 4:27 am
GMATGuruNY wrote:
prabsahi wrote:Please help me clarify the below point.

Isn't EARNED --in option E used as a VERB and not VERB-ed modifier.

Reason--It makes sense with the subject of preceding clause.

If so then it doesnt modify the speed records and because it would require a dedicated subject.

Confused please help.
A DIRECT OBJECT is a noun or noun phrase that RECEIVES the action of the verb.
John hit the ball.
Here, the ball serves as the direct object of hit.

A TRANSITIVE verb is a verb that must take a direct object.
earn is a transitive verb.
Incorrect: Mary earned.
The sentence above does not express a complete thought.
For the sentence to be complete, a direct object is required:
Correct: Mary earned millions.
Here, millions serves as the direct object of earned.

OA: By 1940, the pilot Jacqueline Cochran held seventeen official national and international speed records, earned at a time when aviation was still so new that many of the planes she flew were of dangerously experimental design.
Here, earned is not followed by a direct object and thus cannot be serving as a verb.
The only possible interpretation is that earned is an ADJECTIVE describing the preceding noun (speed records).
So, my takeaway would be:
for VERB-ed modifer
1.Transitive verb should be followed by direct object for it to be a VERB.
2.The Verb should make sense with the subject of preceding clause.

Thanks a lot!!
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