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Opinion on Knewton Diagnostic test.

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by bubbliiiiiiii » Sat Apr 09, 2011 12:52 am
Hello Everyone,

I have just finished with the Knewton Diagnostic test and have scored 620 (V34, Q42).

Last week, I have taken a GMAT Prep test wherein I scored 710.

Queries,

1. I am unable to justify this huge gap of 90 points.
2. Does a diagnostic test have questions that are one level higher in complexity than that of actual GMAT?
3. How is Knewtons diagnostic test rated? (I am not trying to undermine or question Knewton's test but since I read in forum that MGMAT tests contain questions of high complexity than those tested in GMAT, is something similar applicable here as well??)

Guys, Experts please help.
Regards,

Pranay
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by Brent@GMATPrepNow » Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:59 am
bubbliiiiiiii wrote:Hello Everyone,

I have just finished with the Knewton Diagnostic test and have scored 620 (V34, Q42).

Last week, I have taken a GMAT Prep test wherein I scored 710.

Queries,

1. I am unable to justify this huge gap of 90 points.
2. Does a diagnostic test have questions that are one level higher in complexity than that of actual GMAT?
3. How is Knewtons diagnostic test rated? (I am not trying to undermine or question Knewton's test but since I read in forum that MGMAT tests contain questions of high complexity than those tested in GMAT, is something similar applicable here as well??)

Guys, Experts please help.

Hi bubbliiiiiiiii (I hope I have the correct number of i's)

I see a lot of posts on BTG where the 3rd-party CATs (Knewton, Kaplan etc) are treated as though they are equivalent to the GMATPrep tests. While I think that these 3rd-party CATs are excellent resources for working on your timing and identifying weaknesses, I don't think they should be treated as equivalent.

Some points to consider:

First, the questions that appear on the GMATPrep tests are questions that used to appear on the actual GMAT. These questions were given to tens of thousands of students in order to gather sufficient data to determine their level of difficulty. In turn, these results are used to determine the final scores of test-takers. I have a feeling that the 3rd-party CATs do not have the same amount of data on which to base their scores.

Now, at this point, it would be useful to know how the test prep companies collect their data for each question. I'm assuming that they collect data in a similar way (have lots of students take their CATs and note the success rate for each question).

If any reps from the other companies want to weigh in and explain how their CATs work, that would be useful.

I know that I'm over-simplifying the data-gathering process, but if this is how these companies collect information on each question, there are several factors that reduce their accuracy.

When students are taking the real GMAT, they have completed all of their studies. At this point, they are at the "top of their game," and in most cases this test will determine their chances for admission to an MBA program. PLUS, these students just paid $250 to write the test.

Compare this scenario to a student writing a 3-party practice CAT. In this case, the student may be at the beginning of his/her studies and there's very little pressure. So, are the results of this person's test analogous to the results of a students taking an official GMAT? It seems unlikely.

With the 3rd-party tests, there are a lot of variables that do not necessarily line up with the official GMAT, so I think it's important to keep this in mind when they're taking them.
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by therealtomrose » Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:01 am
The standard error on the real GMAT is approximately 30 points. That is, the score that you are awarded might be off by as much as 30 in either direction. The standard error for simulated GMAT tests such as Knewton's test is unpublished, but probably somewhere in the 50 point range.

Add the two error margins together and you have an 80 point swing. Your experience (a 90 point swing) is unlikely, but definitely possible even if the two tests are nearly identical predictors of the GMAT.

When comparing scores on practice tests, it's best to stick with one brand of test. GMAT Prep, is of course the best. After that, just use the practice tests to give you a sense of direction. Are you improving, or not? when you can ace the Knewton test, you'll probably be able to ace the real GMAT too.
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by bubbliiiiiiii » Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:41 am
Thanks Brent and Tom for sparing sometime and clarifying the query.

@Brent, thanks for providing an insight on deciding the difficulty level of questions tested on GMAT Prep.

@Tom, I had planned to restrict myself myself only to GMAT Prep. Somehow, I went a step ahead to try my hand on Knewton Diagnostic test.:) I will keep in mind the deviation and try to practice the tests accordingly.

Since, I have attempted only two practice tests as of now, I think I have to focus more on covering the concepts rather than concentrating on my prep score.

However, can you also suggest me a couple of more tests, only if required, that are recommendable apart from GMAT Prep?
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Pranay
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by Brent@GMATPrepNow » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:57 am
bubbliiiiiiii wrote:Thanks Brent and Tom for sparing sometime and clarifying the query.

@Brent, thanks for providing an insight on deciding the difficulty level of questions tested on GMAT Prep.

@Tom, I had planned to restrict myself myself only to GMAT Prep. Somehow, I went a step ahead to try my hand on Knewton Diagnostic test.:) I will keep in mind the deviation and try to practice the tests accordingly.

Since, I have attempted only two practice tests as of now, I think I have to focus more on covering the concepts rather than concentrating on my prep score.

However, can you also suggest me a couple of more tests, only if required, that are recommendable apart from GMAT Prep?
Another option is to purchase a pack of 3 retired tests from GMAC (https://www.mba.com/store/product-info?SKU=1103260X), although you may have seen some questions in the Official Guides.
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by therealtomrose » Sat Apr 16, 2011 10:13 am
My understanding is that the retired tests you can purchase are not adaptive, so I dis-recommend those. They're basically just lists of extra problems. That's fine, but don't use them for diagnostic purposes like you would a practice test.

I think you really ought to pamper yourself with the ManhattanGMAT practice tests. It's not the tests that are so good, but the assessment reports that come with them. They're best in class (NB, I'm biased.) Also, the tests are adaptive like the GMAT and are supported by tremendous research on the GMAT algorithm.
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by rbhavans » Mon May 16, 2011 9:01 am
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Last edited by rbhavans on Wed May 18, 2011 7:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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by bubbliiiiiiii » Mon May 16, 2011 9:31 pm
Did you try the GMAT prep CAT offered by GMAC?

If yes, how much did you score?
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Pranay
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by beatitin11 » Mon May 16, 2011 10:07 pm
I just took the Knewton Diagnostic today and have scored 660 (Q=45, V=36). I too am surprised by my Q score, as its the lowest I have got so far.

So far the tests I have taken are:
Princeton Review Free test = 610 (Q=47, V=28) (without any preparation, later I had approx 2 months of preparation)
Princeton 1 = 710 (Q=50, V=39)
Kaplan Free test = 670 (Q=47, V=39)
Knewton Diagnostic (today) = 660 (V=45, V=36)

Although, I don't have a reference score of GMATPrep or MGMAT, the above list atleast tells me that Knewton was my lowest score so far after preparation, especially for Q. I ll be starting with MGMAT tests from next weekend onwards. I hope I get some jump in points in MGMAT.
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by rbhavans » Tue May 17, 2011 9:43 am
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by Robbie@Knewton » Tue May 17, 2011 12:22 pm
Hi everyone,

I work at Knewton and wanted to answer a couple of questions directly.

@bubbliiiiiiii: The head of our research team, David Kuntz, is one of the founders of computer adaptive testing and has written extensively about how the GMAT CAT algorithm works on our blog. It should shed some light on why students sometimes experience unusual swings in scores. With respect to differences between CATs from different organizations, all I can say is that we have an excellent track record of preparing students for the actual GMAT and removing the mystery about what they should expect to score.

@rbhavans and @beatitin11: We definitely do not make the first CAT in our course harder than any of the others. For the money-back guarantee, we accept actual GMAT scores as a baseline as well as our own diagnostic scores--so they have to closely mirror each other for the guarantee to be reliable. Our reviews in this forum highlight the number of students who have seen incredible score increases on top of old GMAT scores; there's no need for us to inflate improvements by adjusting the first CAT.

Good luck with your GMAT prep!

Robbie
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by bubbliiiiiiii » Tue May 17, 2011 9:27 pm
Hi Robbie,

Somehow, I got an idea that may be I have been mistaken in this thread.

Just to make my intention clear on starting this thread is not to question the track record or authencity of Knewton. I have seen a couple of videos from Knewton on SC and they are really fabulous.

My sole intention was and is to know the difference in my score levels between that of GMAT prep and Knewton Diagnostic test.
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Pranay
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by rbhavans » Wed May 18, 2011 7:07 am
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