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is 3 attempts maximum that B-schools permit? :(

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is 3 attempts maximum that B-schools permit? :(

by linkinpark » Thu Jan 14, 2010 1:21 am
Hello fellow BTG members, instructors, admission-consultants and whoever happens to read this

My GMAT journey has been 2+ years now and 3 times I've been punched on actual GMAT. First time I was hopeless I did aimless preparation, didn't new what concepts etc I'll be grilled on. Second time is not explainable we all know how bad last 1.5 - 2 years has been *period* and today was 3rd shot at G but I stumbled again though with considerable improvement over where I stood last year 2008-2009-2010 almost each shot at 9 months' interval score this time was higher than last two

530 - 480 - 580(45, 25). I don't know what all should I do I am obsessed by GMAT and considering to put 4th shot in schedule but I've been doing net-search about GMAT schools and how it might affect admission process.

Is it true that one shouldn't appear for GMAT more than 3 times? Is 580 absolutely stupid a score to be considered for application? I'm just another Indian IT guy with 7+ years experience, won't these 7 years weigh overall? I know guys like me are numerous in market keen to apply for MBA overseas but still I'm just considering what are chances for me to get into say in top 30-40 B-schools. I am more interested in Singapore(NUS, SIM, NTU), France, UK other countries I'm not a keen at the moment just personal choice. and yes I want courses with duration of maximu 16-18 months. I don't know I'm skeptic about 1 year MBA isn't it too rigorous for a normal person?

I'm not demotivated by 3 attempts but worried if 4th will be negative point on my apps. I've 3 years overseas experience from my total, if that has some benefit I don't know. Right now going through catch-22, on one side I'm thinking if I can't clear GMAT how on earth I'll do a MBA or other masters degree, on the flip side I feel and I know GMAT is kind of logical game that controls your thoughts with lot of brain teasers.

Materials I've
Manhattan Verbal guides, OG-11, 12, Resources from this + manhattan site like flashcards from both.

I'm right now tensed and angry on myself don't know where am I heading to.... I really want to get MBA or my desired Masters (non-IT)

I was aiming for 650+ which I guess is sufficient for Singapore Universities, was hitting around higher 500 in MGMAT and 600, 610 on GPREP.

Verbal was way too hard on gmat and mathematics was not easy either but questions were tested on concepts similar to those in OG and Manhattan tests.

Please someone guide me...

by the way this forum is awesome, my sincere respect and thanks to guys like Eric who came up with this forum then Ron, Stacey, Stuart, Brent, Ian and other community members whose answers were really great to test and fix the concepts.
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by papgust » Thu Jan 14, 2010 9:29 pm
Hey Satish,

Sorry to hear your bad experience. Anyways, it's a good 100-point improvement from the previous exam. As far as i know, one must avoid writing exam more than 4 times. Writing more than 4 times creates a bad impression on the candidate. So, i think you must give a shot one last time.
If you are deciding to give a shot, then you must have a different strategy this time. As your quants looks fine and verbal requires some work out, you should allot 70% of your prep time in verbal and 30% in quants.
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by papgust » Thu Jan 14, 2010 9:30 pm
Hey Satish,

Sorry to hear your bad experience. Anyways, it's a good 100-point improvement from the previous exam. As far as i know, one must avoid writing exam more than 4 times. Writing more than 4 times creates a bad impression on the candidate. So, i think you must give a shot one last time.
If you are deciding to give a shot, then you must have a different strategy this time. As your quants looks fine and verbal requires some work out, you should allot 70% of your prep time in verbal and 30% in quants.
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by linkinpark » Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:01 am
Hey Pradeep,
Thanks for replying. I tried many things but somewhere Verbal is killing my confidence. I did Manhattan SC guide thoroughly was hitting good on OG11 SC. Did Manhattan CR and RC, improved on both as well. Also got notes from Powerscore bible that my friend made last year were add-on to Manhattan CR guide.
are 1000 SC, CR good sources? I think I lost confidence during verbal on actual test and was behind normal time throught the verbal.
Right now I'm thinking what all I must do in order to hit 40+ on verbal.... Was considering to opt for tutor but don't have idea if its worth the $.

One thing I didn't mention - I've not been studying for full 2.5 years for GMAT its just 2-3 months before exam and this time I put my good efforts may be not best. I've finished OG11,12 problems, don't know if I should pick other book or what. Basics of english grammar + basics of 10+2 mathematics is must I am sure because 45 on Q is ok not great.

Thanks
530->480->580
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by vivecan2005 » Mon Jan 18, 2010 10:29 am
linkinpark wrote:Hey Pradeep,
Thanks for replying. I tried many things but somewhere Verbal is killing my confidence. I did Manhattan SC guide thoroughly was hitting good on OG11 SC. Did Manhattan CR and RC, improved on both as well. Also got notes from Powerscore bible that my friend made last year were add-on to Manhattan CR guide.
are 1000 SC, CR good sources? I think I lost confidence during verbal on actual test and was behind normal time throught the verbal.
Right now I'm thinking what all I must do in order to hit 40+ on verbal.... Was considering to opt for tutor but don't have idea if its worth the $.

One thing I didn't mention - I've not been studying for full 2.5 years for GMAT its just 2-3 months before exam and this time I put my good efforts may be not best. I've finished OG11,12 problems, don't know if I should pick other book or what. Basics of english grammar + basics of 10+2 mathematics is must I am sure because 45 on Q is ok not great.

Thanks
Solution of your problem is time and practice. Don't die for MBA this year. Give yourself plenty time. Abused H1B workers have lost thier mental presence and trying to climb ladder within a month or two month. Give plenty of time, relax and practice. I am sure you have a sense of urgency which is killing you. GMAT is an intensive test and requires very calm, focused mind.

Let me ask you:

Do you shake your legs while sitting in chair for a long time?
Do you forget sometimes that what information you were trying to google and just trying to remember the key words in front of google website?
Do you jump on the sections of GMAT while preparing like today you were studying Critical reasoning and tomorrow sentence correction?
Do you motivate yourself through browsing the successful scores on forums because of lack of internal motivation from inside of you?
Do you dream to be in managerial position or be in top business school immediately and get a deep breath while you think about GMAT?

If any, all or most of above symptoms apply to you then you should give yourself plenty time to relax and stablize yourself before prepare any exam. If GMAT would be so easy to tacel then its benefits would not be so much so take it as a special level and prepare for it. Mostly people, no matter how good book they are using, are suffering from internal reasons where no powerscore, MGMAT work.
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by DavidP » Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:15 pm
Sorry to hear about your experience with the GMAT, Satish. As you've probably seen, I sent an email to the Manhattan GMAT team asking them to provide you with advice about whether you should take the GMAT a fourth time because you've been using the Manhattan GMAT materials to prepare.

I hope that they will reply to this post soon and provide good advice that will help you and other members of the Beat The GMAT community!
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by michael.dinerstein » Tue Jan 19, 2010 1:10 pm
Hey Satish,

First off, congrats on getting your highest score yet on the GMAT! I know it may seem like you are still behind, but any type of real improvement is good on this exam.

With that said, taking the GMAT more than 3 times over a period of 2 years will not negatively impact your business school application. With that said, if you do plan to take the GMAT again, it is key to make sure that you have made marked improvement from your most recent attempt because taking the test more than 4 times might look bad on your application.

Your 580 score might be good enough for some of the schools you want to attend. What do their average GMAT scores look like? Are they around a 580? One thing that might raise a red flag, however, is the large gap between your math and verbal subscores. Working to balance these scores on your next attempt is essential. Remember, business schools use the GMAT to determine whether or not you are prepared to handle a business school's course of study, so your 7 years experience in the IT field will stand out on your application regardless of your score. However, it's still important to score well on the exam because it does clue universities into how well your performance will be during your first year. I personally think that you should focus on raising your verbal score - doing so will add considerably to your overall performance and will make you a more attractive candidate for b-school.

As for a 1-year MBA, I would advise against applying for these types of programs, as they are indeed quite rigorous.

I think your next step should be to seriously consider enrolling in a prep course. I've noticed that you haven't taken a class and have relied on self-studying techniques for the GMAT. I have a feeling that you need some additional assistance from an Instructor who has taken the GMAT and will be able to impart other strategies and content-learning that you may not have necessarily done on your own time. Expanding the resources you use to prepare for the exam will provide you with access to a greater knowledge bank, thus increasing the educational tools you have at your disposal to prepare for the next test.

Let me know what you think about all of this or if you need any additional questions answered!

Best,
Michael Dinerstein
Manager of Online Marketing
Manhattan GMAT
212-721-7400
800-576-4628
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by linkinpark » Tue Jan 19, 2010 1:28 pm
Hi Michael and David,
Thank you very much for replying on this thread. Yes I'm considering classes because I am poor at least on verbal section of GMAT.

Over this weekend I'll review feedback and then decide about enrolling.

Regards,
Satish
530->480->580
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by linkinpark » Tue Jan 19, 2010 1:40 pm
vivecan2005 wrote: Solution of your problem is time and practice. Don't die for MBA this year. Give yourself plenty time. Abused H1B workers have lost thier mental presence and trying to climb ladder within a month or two month. Give plenty of time, relax and practice. I am sure you have a sense of urgency which is killing you. GMAT is an intensive test and requires very calm, focused mind. Totally agreed, though I'm not H1B. I've decided I won't schedule next date unless I get a 7++ on either Manhattan or GPREP test

Let me ask you:

Do you shake your legs while sitting in chair for a long time? No I don't
Do you forget sometimes that what information you were trying to google and just trying to remember the key words in front of google website?No I don't
Do you jump on the sections of GMAT while preparing like today you were studying Critical reasoning and tomorrow sentence correction?No I don't when I've to learn concepts, but while practice I tend to do few questions from 3-5 sections
Do you motivate yourself through browsing the successful scores on forums because of lack of internal motivation from inside of you?I don't lack internal motivation as such but I read success stories here on BTG to know like how a person prepared etc
Do you dream to be in managerial position or be in top business school immediately and get a deep breath while you think about GMAT? Honestly I've not dreamt of either, because I focus on one thing at a time right now its GMAT time

If any, all or most of above symptoms apply to you then you should give yourself plenty time to relax and stablize yourself before prepare any exam. If GMAT would be so easy to tacel then its benefits would not be so much so take it as a special level and prepare for it. Mostly people, no matter how good book they are using, are suffering from internal reasons where no powerscore, MGMAT work. Perhaps yes, but I don't think thats the case with me, I'm completely aware that GMAT is must and I've to get it done with a nice score.


Thanks for bringing up these points
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by Shawshank » Wed Jan 20, 2010 6:12 am
I dnt understand vivecan2005.
What do these points signify.... If one moves his leg while being seated on a chair,,, He is not prepared for GMAT is it ???
How do u deduce that bro,,,,
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by vivecan2005 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 1:36 pm
Shawshank wrote:I dnt understand vivecan2005.
What do these points signify.... If one moves his leg while being seated on a chair,,, He is not prepared for GMAT is it ???
How do u deduce that bro,,,,
leg shaking:
It shows the need to practice maintaining concentration and focus on long passages. It also shows the probability of passive reading where to try to scan the passage rather than actively reading and looking for implied meaning, structure of argument. These gestures symbolizes lack of concentration and interest both.
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by rohan_vus » Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:15 pm
vivecan2005 wrote:
Shawshank wrote:I dnt understand vivecan2005.
What do these points signify.... If one moves his leg while being seated on a chair,,, He is not prepared for GMAT is it ???
How do u deduce that bro,,,,
leg shaking:
It shows the need to practice maintaining concentration and focus on long passages. It also shows the probability of passive reading where to try to scan the passage rather than actively reading and looking for implied meaning, structure of argument. These gestures symbolizes lack of concentration and interest both.
Still, leg shaking is not necessarity attributed to lack of concentration. Its very subjective . Many people shake legs as part of comfortable posture . So what you deduced and generalized for all is'nt true for every people .Physical gestures may be important but dont neccessarily matter for all that much compared to mental attitude .
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by Osirus@VeritasPrep » Sat Jan 30, 2010 11:03 am
you can take it again, you just have to ensure that your score will be significantly higher in order to justify the retakes.
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