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which is worse: not showing up or getting a low score?

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which is worse: not showing up or getting a low score?

by hecubus330 » Mon Jul 19, 2010 12:39 pm
I take my GMAT tomorrow. I'm not ready. I thought I would be ready by now when I scheduled the appointment 3-4 months ago but I am not.
I scored a 510 on GMAT Prep1. My study has been slow due to working two jobs and taking a summer algebra class. There are still more basic concepts I need to learn and I know I can do better once I learn them.

Either way I am out $250. So what should I do?

-take the GMAT and score high 400s or low 500s take it again in October
-don't show up and schedule an appointment for October

My original plan was too apply Round 1 for fall 2011; UCLA, USC, and two second tier schools. Now I am thinking about applying to round 2 to just second tier schools.


I know if I go take the test and cancel my scores at the test site that will show up on the score report as well.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
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by gmat_dawg » Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:17 pm
hecubus330 wrote:I take my GMAT tomorrow. I'm not ready. I thought I would be ready by now when I scheduled the appointment 3-4 months ago but I am not.
I scored a 510 on GMAT Prep1. My study has been slow due to working two jobs and taking a summer algebra class. There are still more basic concepts I need to learn and I know I can do better once I learn them.

Either way I am out $250. So what should I do?

-take the GMAT and score high 400s or low 500s take it again in October
-don't show up and schedule an appointment for October

My original plan was too apply Round 1 for fall 2011; UCLA, USC, and two second tier schools. Now I am thinking about applying to round 2 to just second tier schools.


I know if I go take the test and cancel my scores at the test site that will show up on the score report as well.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Don't show up. Don't even think about applying with a 510 to USC or UCLA.

They won't even read your application. If they see that score on your official score summary, they might like you less as well (given you have a higher score on a subsequent retake)

Unless you want to go to USC don't even bother taking the gmat until you can get a 700 with your eyes closed on GMAT prep each and every time.
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by uwhusky » Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:23 pm
gmat_dawg wrote: Unless you want to go to USC don't even bother taking the gmat until you can get a 700 with your eyes closed on GMAT prep each and every time.
Wow, I don't know about that...
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by hecubus330 » Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:27 pm
I just know I need a minimum 680 before applying to USC or UCLA. I know I can get there; just not tomorrow.
I'm just looking at the best case scenario for the hole I dug myself into.
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by gmat_dawg » Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:32 pm
hecubus330 wrote:I just know I need a minimum 680 before applying to USC or UCLA. I know I can get there; just not tomorrow.
I'm just looking at the best case scenario for the hole I dug myself into.
USC 680 is doable as long as you have good rest of application including GPA and Essays and career track and recommendations.

With UCLA, it's also doable but less than USC. For the most part, you need 700 or more to get into UCLA.
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by gmatguytoday » Mon Jul 19, 2010 4:00 pm
I say you go ahead and take it and get a feel for it. You're out the $250 anyway. Just don't choose any schools to have your scores sent to. Let's say you take it and score low 500's this go around, and next time you come back with a 700. You now have a story to go along with your apps. Seems like win/win to me. I especially don't think you can discount the experience of sitting for the test. If anything, it should help to open your eyes a bit about the experience as a whole.

Question....why did you not reschedule earlier if you felt you weren't prepared?
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by gmat_dawg » Mon Jul 19, 2010 4:14 pm
gmatguytoday wrote:I say you go ahead and take it and get a feel for it. You're out the $250 anyway. Just don't choose any schools to have your scores sent to. Let's say you take it and score low 500's this go around, and next time you come back with a 700. You now have a story to go along with your apps. Seems like win/win to me. I especially don't think you can discount the experience of sitting for the test. If anything, it should help to open your eyes a bit about the experience as a whole.

Question....why did you not reschedule earlier if you felt you weren't prepared?
Don't do it man if you're not scoring 600 at least on GMAT prep. Even if you are scoring 600 on GMATprep that score is easier to get than 600 on the real test.

It's better to apply with one 700 than one with a 510 and 700 later. Especially if the rest of the application looks good.

First of all, most people who get 700 don't get 510 even if they don't study. They might think, "WTF? what is that black eye on the application doing there?"
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by hecubus330 » Mon Jul 19, 2010 4:52 pm
When I got the 510 on GMATPrep1 I thought, "well I was planning on taking it twice anyway may as well go now since I paid the money and took off of work." I guess reality really hit me today.
Right now it seems pointless to go in knowing I'll get in the low 500s.
I'm paying for the wrong decisions I have made.
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by gmat_dawg » Mon Jul 19, 2010 5:13 pm
hecubus330 wrote:When I got the 510 on GMATPrep1 I thought, "well I was planning on taking it twice anyway may as well go now since I paid the money and took off of work." I guess reality really hit me today.
Right now it seems pointless to go in knowing I'll get in the low 500s.
I'm paying for the wrong decisions I have made.
Forget it dude, if you got 510 on GMATPrep you will likely get below 500 on GMAT because GMAT is harder than Prep. Remember all your scores go on the official report the schools get. How would you like it if Adcom sees that 470 on your score report?
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by hecubus330 » Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:55 pm
I ate the $250. I rescheduled for October (yes another $250). If I'm not hitting 600 by October there is no hope.
I'm taking a GMAT Prep class that starts next month.
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by gmat_dawg » Mon Jul 19, 2010 10:55 pm
uwhusky wrote:
gmat_dawg wrote: Unless you want to go to USC don't even bother taking the gmat until you can get a 700 with your eyes closed on GMAT prep each and every time.
Wow, I don't know about that...
I"m just saying that from experience. I applied to USC and UCLA, albeit the part time programs with a 680. I got rejected by both with that score. USC part time mba mean gmat is around 610 or so. UCLA's is 690. UC Berkeley is also around 690 to 700.

I know that USC was on the fence about me because right before they decided to reject they called me and asked me what I was doing these days as I wasn't working when I applied. UCLA didn't even bother doing that. Same with Berkeley (although they at least invited me for an interview but I think that's just based on a cutoff GMAT).

I know that the full time program scores are even higher. For example USC is like 690 or 700 I believe and UCLA's like 715 or something.

I'm of the opinion that unless you have something really special going on in the rest of your application such as unique leadership, a history of promotions and high salary, it's always better to apply with at least the mean GMAT to give yourself a fair chance.
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by essaysnark » Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:23 pm
gmat_dawg wrote:
uwhusky wrote:
gmat_dawg wrote: Unless you want to go to USC don't even bother taking the gmat until you can get a 700 with your eyes closed on GMAT prep each and every time.
Wow, I don't know about that...
I"m just saying that from experience. I applied to USC and UCLA, albeit the part time programs with a 680. I got rejected by both with that score. USC part time mba mean gmat is around 610 or so. UCLA's is 690. UC Berkeley is also around 690 to 700.
EssaySnark says, hate to be negative, but it's unlike that a 680 score kept you out of USC. Or UCLA, for that matter. A 680 is often "good enough" at many programs considered tougher than these two. If the 680 was entirely weighted to the verbal side, then yes, that alone could've been a big factor in rejection. But a balanced 680 as a component of an otherwise strong app should see success at this tier of schools. EssaySnark is assuming there was something else going on.

Good news is, if you didn't get in anywhere last year, even a small improvement in the GMAT score (and fixing whatever else may have been deficient) could help you make it this time around.

Back to the OP: EssaySnark thinks you made the right decision by not showing up for your test. You could've tested and canceled the score -- there is possibly some value in going through the whole experience -- but a canceled score would probably need explaining in an optional essay. Better to have just ditched it entirely, as you did, and keep the record clean. EssaySnark agrees that any score below 600 -- even if supplemented by a second test in the 700 range -- would raise doubts at the adcom.

And yes, this stuff is incredibly stressful -- hang in there!
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
https://essaysnark.com/bookstore/
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by gmat_dawg » Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:38 pm
essaysnark wrote:
gmat_dawg wrote:
uwhusky wrote:
gmat_dawg wrote: Unless you want to go to USC don't even bother taking the gmat until you can get a 700 with your eyes closed on GMAT prep each and every time.
Wow, I don't know about that...
I"m just saying that from experience. I applied to USC and UCLA, albeit the part time programs with a 680. I got rejected by both with that score. USC part time mba mean gmat is around 610 or so. UCLA's is 690. UC Berkeley is also around 690 to 700.
EssaySnark says, hate to be negative, but it's unlike that a 680 score kept you out of USC. Or UCLA, for that matter. A 680 is often "good enough" at many programs considered tougher than these two. If the 680 was entirely weighted to the verbal side, then yes, that alone could've been a big factor in rejection. But a balanced 680 as a component of an otherwise strong app should see success at this tier of schools. EssaySnark is assuming there was something else going on.

Good news is, if you didn't get in anywhere last year, even a small improvement in the GMAT score (and fixing whatever else may have been deficient) could help you make it this time around.

Back to the OP: EssaySnark thinks you made the right decision by not showing up for your test. You could've tested and canceled the score -- there is possibly some value in going through the whole experience -- but a canceled score would probably need explaining in an optional essay. Better to have just ditched it entirely, as you did, and keep the record clean. EssaySnark agrees that any score below 600 -- even if supplemented by a second test in the 700 range -- would raise doubts at the adcom.

And yes, this stuff is incredibly stressful -- hang in there!
Hey Essaysnark,

I was 33 when I applied with the 680, and also unemployed and applying to fully employed (part time) programs at UCLA, USC, and UC Berkeley.

I also have a 2.15 gpa from an Ivy with pretty inconsistent work experience (bad overall career track progression).

Anyways, yeah I agree that if everything else was average to solid and I applied with a 680, I would have at least got into USC.

I'm a pretty good essay writer as well. Have some volunteer experience working with Orphans and pro bono work with entrepreneurs helping them set up their accounting system, getting their books in order, or writing business plans.

So what do you think now? I turn 35 next month and I decided to try to get a CPA by the end of the year and retake the GMAT again. I will apply again to the same exact schools in the first round this time by the end of Fall this year.

By back up plan is to apply to UC Irvine Fully employed MBA for their Spring accelerated 27 month program.

Any tips?
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by gmat_dawg » Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:39 pm
And I forgot to mention that the 680 is a 41/41 even split quant and verbal (68%, 92% respectively). The verbal held up the score. I think I suck at math.

Nowadays I think I can more or less score mid 40's in quant but for some reason I can't seem to break 40 on the verbal. Anyways I need to study more and score 700's with my eyes closed on all the practice tests. My goal is to get 49 Quant and 43 Verbal. I think that could be 750, which if I can pull off, I swear I will forever pat myself in the back because it will be like a crowning victory for me.
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by essaysnark » Wed Jul 21, 2010 10:45 pm
gmat_dawg wrote:I was 33 when I applied with the 680, and also unemployed and applying to fully employed (part time) programs at UCLA, USC, and UC Berkeley.

I also have a 2.15 gpa from an Ivy with pretty inconsistent work experience (bad overall career track progression).
EssaySnark says, bold text above is your issue (or issues). Our advice? TAKE A CLASS. Or two. You need to offset that GPA. UCLA may have a tough time overlooking it, and USC might as well. You need to give them reason to feel confident that you will take school seriously. Yes, college was a long time ago. Take a heavyduty quantitative class and prove them that you can hack it. (See here for more tips on offsetting a low GPA: https://essaysnark.blocked/2010/05/ ... -days.html )

You will also need to take control of your message around the career history. And you'll need to explain why now is the right time to go to bschool. 35 isn't "too old" but you're on the outer edge of the spectrum, even at the P/T programs.

The CPA probably won't hurt but if you're doing that as part of your reapp strategy, we don't think it's going to add much. More important will be redoing the GMAT and bumping up the quant, as you're already working on. If you can't get verbal above 40, don't sweat it. They'll appreciate the higher verbal side no matter what. You just need to convince them that you'll succeed in their program. Slamming it home on the GMAT will serve you on many levels: it can partially offset the GPA (in other words, a high GMAT will help you balance the low GPA more than the same combo of stats would do for a younger candidate), and it can give you stuff to present as "how I've improved my profile" as a reapplicant (assuming you are one; it sounded like maybe your first apps were two years ago, in which case you'll be presenting "fresh" to them again now).

The volunteer work stories totally don't matter for you yet; they're adding nothing until you get the baselie package in order.

EssaySnark is feeling a little more bullish on the UC Irvine idea. We hate to squash dreams and definitely are not saying not to try again at these other schools, but it will be more of a long shot for you, unless you really have some compelling data to present in how you've fixed these gaps in your profile.

Good luck with it!
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
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