Ambiguous question

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Ambiguous question

by thailandvc » Tue Aug 04, 2009 3:17 am
Anybody else think this is ambiguous?

"Can the positive integer n be written as the sum of two positive prime number?

1) n greater than 3
2) n is odd "

I put D. It's wrong. Couple issues i have with this question from the official quant review.

1) "positive prime" ? I thought all prime are positive starting with 2
2) If one is true, then the fact that n is a positive is redundant

those two things together threw me off. then the question "can it be written?" Yes. Even though n can be 9 (3+6, one prime one not) or 4 (2+2). The fact of "can it" is yes. it is sufficient.

Had they asked "Is n the sum of two prime" then I agree with the answer.
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by italian7745 » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:09 am
Is the answer E...

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by belize » Tue Aug 04, 2009 7:34 am
I think the answer is E. I solve it by picking a few numbers to test the statements:

(1) N>3
pick integer 5, it could be 2+3 (sum of two primes),
but it could also be 1+4 (not primes)
try another integer 6, it could be 3+3 or 2+4
so eliminate choice A and D

(2) N is odd
pick integer 7, it could be 2+5 (sum of two primes),
but it could also be 3+4 (4 is not prime)
try another odd integer 3, it could be 1+2 (1 is not prime)
so eliminate choice B

(1) and (2)
since the integers we picked in (2) are already >3, so we can eliminate choice C

Answer is E. Is this correct?

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by mohitsharda » Tue Aug 04, 2009 9:02 am
I think the answer is A

1) If N>3 then it can always be expressed as a sum of two prime numbers.
It can be expressed as sum of non primes as well, but the answer for the question that "can it be expressed as a sum of prime numbers" is Yes

2) N odd..
1 is positive and odd but cant be expressed as a sum of prime numbers.
5 is positive and odd and equal to 2+3... so it can be expressed.

Hence, the answer is A... Statement 1 is enough but statement 2 is not
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Re: Ambiguous question

by Ian Stewart » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:47 pm
thailandvc wrote:Anybody else think this is ambiguous?

"Can the positive integer n be written as the sum of two positive prime number?

1) n greater than 3
2) n is odd "

I put D. It's wrong. Couple issues i have with this question from the official quant review.

1) "positive prime" ? I thought all prime are positive starting with 2
2) If one is true, then the fact that n is a positive is redundant

those two things together threw me off. then the question "can it be written?" Yes. Even though n can be 9 (3+6, one prime one not) or 4 (2+2). The fact of "can it" is yes. it is sufficient.

Had they asked "Is n the sum of two prime" then I agree with the answer.
The phrase 'positive prime number' is redundant - every prime is positive - but otherwise I do not find the question ambiguous. The answer is certainly E. A number like 11 cannot be written as the sum of two primes; since 11 is odd, you'd need to add an even and an odd to get 11, and the only even prime is 2. Since 9 is not prime, you cannot write 11 as the sum of two primes.

It is, incidentally, a famous open problem in Number Theory - can every *even* number be written as a sum of two primes? Number theorists believe that to be true, but to this day, no one has been able to prove it.
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by thailandvc » Wed Aug 05, 2009 2:13 am
E.

I find the wording "can it" confusing because "can it" and "is it" is different. If you understood it as "can it" then I think D is correct. Can a number greater than 3 be written as two prime. the answer is always yes.

Is it? no, like 9.

I guess it is only me that find that confusing.

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My choice is E

by mark412 » Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:22 pm
Guys,

First, Yes I do feel the question is a bit ambiguous. But I will devise an interpretation based on what I think it means. Only here to provide additional insight and help. Let's begin.

In this case my answer to the above question is E.

(1) Tells us that N>3, it is made up of 2 prime #'s.

well 3+7>3, 5+7>3.... it does not tell us anything else. It can be devised to be a combination of numbers. So i choose this as insufficient.

(2) Since n is odd, the sum of the two prime bumbers must yield an odd answer. The only way to do that is by combining 2 to any of the prime numbers. N being odd can be seen as correct. Insufficient

Like I mentioned, since there is ambiguity and plenty of room to debate and determine the meaning of the question, this is just my 2 cents. I see the pitfall in my own explanation (that yes 2 combined with any prime would yield an odd result).[/u]

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by sensei_mike » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:03 pm
Hey Guys,

I'm happy I wasn't the only one confused by the wording of this question! I also take "can" to mean "is there a possibility that". The answer to that of course, would be yes. (since in some cases it is possible, others, not).

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by Gurpinder » Mon Jun 13, 2011 8:18 am
thailandvc wrote:
"Can the positive integer n be written as the sum of two positive prime number?

1) n greater than 3
2) n is odd "
Why doesent (C) make sense?

(1) n>3
(2) n=odd


to make odd, you need even+odd.
So 2,3 = 5.
^ satisfies all conditions. Or am I thinking something wrong?
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by ajelias » Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:36 pm
I know this is an old topic but i just completed this same problem in the OG supplement and felt the exact same way as the original poster.

I understood "can" to mean "is there a possibility that" when obviously that isn't what GMAC thinks it means.

I understand the explanation now, because I suppose since both scenarios can yield either a yes or no answer (aka maybe) that it is INSUFFICIENT, just as if the question were phrased "is the positive integer the sum of two different positive prime numbers?"

However, dictionary.com writes one definition of the word "can" as "to be able to." Doesn't GMAC like to avoid controversy? If I got this question wrong on the actual GMAT, I would be furious with this wording. Asking if n has the ability to be written as the sum of two prime numbers means, according to that definition, that if there is even one possibility that the answer is "yes" then the scenario is SUFFICIENT.

I hope to not see any of this wording on the exam. At least I know to look out for it now though.

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by Ian Stewart » Mon Sep 12, 2011 2:50 am
ajelias wrote:
I understood "can" to mean "is there a possibility that" when obviously that isn't what GMAC thinks it means.

I understand the explanation now, because I suppose since both scenarios can yield either a yes or no answer (aka maybe) that it is INSUFFICIENT, just as if the question were phrased "is the positive integer the sum of two different positive prime numbers?"

However, dictionary.com writes one definition of the word "can" as "to be able to." Doesn't GMAC like to avoid controversy? If I got this question wrong on the actual GMAT, I would be furious with this wording. Asking if n has the ability to be written as the sum of two prime numbers means, according to that definition, that if there is even one possibility that the answer is "yes" then the scenario is SUFFICIENT.

I hope to not see any of this wording on the exam. At least I know to look out for it now though.
I guess I don't understand what it is about the wording that so many people find ambiguous. The use of language here is entirely standard on the GMAT, and in mathematics in general, and you're quite likely to encounter similarly worded questions in the future, so it would be worth taking some time to be sure you understand it.

From the comments above, it may be that the issue is not with the wording of the problem itself, but with approach to DS questions. When you say this:
ajelias wrote:
Asking if n has the ability to be written as the sum of two prime numbers means, according to that definition, that if there is even one possibility that the answer is "yes" then the scenario is SUFFICIENT.
this not how you answer a DS question, at least if I've understood what you're trying to say. In a yes/no DS question, a statement is *not* sufficient if it means that "there is even one possibility that the answer is 'yes'". You have sufficient information if the *only* possible answer to the question is yes. If the answer might be yes, and might be no, then the information is *not* sufficient.

So when we see this question:

"Can the positive integer n be written as the sum of two positive prime numbers? "

first, as in any DS question with an unknown value, n represents some fixed positive integer. We don't know what n is (though we'll learn some things about n from the statements), but it represents a single numerical value. We want to know if n can be expressed as the sum of two primes. We certainly need more information about n to be able to answer this question. If n=1, say, then certainly there is no way to write n as the sum of two primes. But if n=5, say, then we can write n as 3+2. And even using both of the statements, it remains possible that n=5, and n can be expressed as the sum of two primes and the answer is 'yes', or that n=11 and n cannot be expressed as the sum of two primes, and the answer is 'no'. When you can get both a yes and a no answer using your statements, then they are by definition insufficient.
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