MGMAT number properties

This topic has expert replies
User avatar
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:22 am
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Thanked: 1 times

MGMAT number properties

by Dinen » Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:39 am
Hi all....here goes my first post on this forum. My query refers to DS problem 10, Chapter 10 (p.133) Mgmat number properties:
Question states:

"Is the sum of integers a and b divisible by 7?
1) a is not divisible by 7.
2) a-b is divisible by 7.

Herewith my interpretation: 1) Obviously insufficient
2) If a-b is divisible by 7, hence a-b is a multiple of 7. Rule states that when adding/subtracting a mulitple of say N, to a non-multiple of N, one would always get a multiple of N as the answer. Apply this to the above, statement 2 tells me either a or b is a multiple of seven and the other is not. Extrapolating this arguement , I can conclude the same for a + b and hence say sufficient ie. answer B.
However answer is C (both statements required). Even tho' they give numerical examples illustrating why 2 is insufficient (ie a, b = 21, 14 & a,b = 20, 13) and go on with a remainder explanation that I'm still trying to wrap my head around, the fundamentalist in me still requires someone to point out why my reasoning alluded to above is incorrect! Input will sincerely be appreciated....ta in advance.

[/i]
You never too old to grow up
Source: — Data Sufficiency |

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 1179
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 9:07 pm
Location: Milpitas, CA
Thanked: 447 times
Followed by:88 members

by Rahul@gurome » Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:05 am
(1) is NOT SUFFICIENT.

(2) If a = 32, b = 4, then a - b = 28, divisible by 7. But a + b = 32 + 4 = 36, not divisible by 7.
If a = 35, b = 7, then a - b = 28, divisible by 7. But a + b = 35 + 7 = 42, divisible by 7.
So, we are not getting a unique answer.
Hence, (2) is NOT SUFFICIENT.

Combining (1) and (2), we know a is not divisible by 7 but a - b is divisible by 7.
a - b = 7k, where k is an integer
a = b + 7k
a + b = (b + 7k) + b = 2b + 7k
b will either be an even or odd integer, but 2b will always be an even integer. This implies 2b + 7k can never be divisible by 7.
So, the answer to the main question is "no".

The correct answer is (C).
Hope this helps?
Rahul Lakhani
Quant Expert
Gurome, Inc.
https://www.GuroMe.com
On MBA sabbatical (at ISB) for 2011-12 - will stay active as time permits
1-800-566-4043 (USA)
+91-99201 32411 (India)

User avatar
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:22 am
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Thanked: 1 times

by Dinen » Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:36 am
Thanks mate for that prompt response. While going thr' your explanation, I realised I got my rules confused...lol! Anyway I'm with u up until the end when u say 2b + 7k will never be divisible by 7....why?....I understand that b + 7k is not divisible by 7 but battling to see final implication that 2b + 7k is not. I'm sorry for my "numbskull" here but have only just started and battling with concepts I have'nt seen in years. Thanks
You never too old to grow up

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 1179
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 9:07 pm
Location: Milpitas, CA
Thanked: 447 times
Followed by:88 members

by Rahul@gurome » Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:42 am
Dinen wrote:Thanks mate for that prompt response. While going thr' your explanation, I realised I got my rules confused...lol! Anyway I'm with u up until the end when u say 2b + 7k will never be divisible by 7....why?....I understand that b + 7k is not divisible by 7 but battling to see final implication that 2b + 7k is not. I'm sorry for my "numbskull" here but have only just started and battling with concepts I have'nt seen in years. Thanks
2b + 7k will not be divisible by 7 as 2b is an even integer and when an even integer is added to a multiple of 7, then the resulting number will not be divisible by 7. Example: If 2b = 4 and 7k = 28, then 2b + 7k = 4 + 28 = 32, which is not divisible by 7. For 2b + 7k to be divisible by 7, 2b should also be a factor of 7, which is not the case.
Does that help?
Rahul Lakhani
Quant Expert
Gurome, Inc.
https://www.GuroMe.com
On MBA sabbatical (at ISB) for 2011-12 - will stay active as time permits
1-800-566-4043 (USA)
+91-99201 32411 (India)

Master | Next Rank: 500 Posts
Posts: 114
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2008 3:51 am
Thanked: 8 times
GMAT Score:680

by Fiver » Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:54 am
Is (a+b) a multiple of 7 ?

St1] a is not divisible by 7.
Insuff.
If both are multiples of 7 then the answer is yes.
If both are non-multiples of 7 then the answer could be no.
e.g. 5 & 12

St2] a-b is divisible by 7
Insuff.
Again the same as above holds good

Together.
If both 'a' & (a-b) are non-multiples of 7, it means that each 'a' & 'b' is also a non-multiple of 7.
Hence assume a = b+7
Our question can be re-framed as is (b + b +7) a multiple of 7 ?
Therefore is (2b + 7) a multiple of 7?
This is only possible if 'b' is a multiple of 7.
And we have proved that neither 'a' nor 'b' can be multiples of 7.
Hence the answer to the question is no.
Choose C.

User avatar
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:22 am
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Thanked: 1 times

by Dinen » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:06 am
Ok...getting there slowly. I want to run this explanation by u which I do understand..... Since a=b+7k and we know a is not a multiple of 7, hence b cannot be a multiple of 7 in order to satisfy equation (non multiple = Multiple - non-multiple). This means 2b cannot be a multiple of 7. In final step where a+b=2b+7k....(a+b) cannot be a mulitple of 7 (using above rule) cause we adding a multiple and a non-multiple. Phew!....Is this reasoning correct? Thanks amigo!
You never too old to grow up

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
GMAT Instructor
Posts: 1179
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 9:07 pm
Location: Milpitas, CA
Thanked: 447 times
Followed by:88 members

by Rahul@gurome » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:08 am
Dinen wrote:Ok...getting there slowly. I want to run this explanation by u which I do understand..... Since a=b+7k and we know a is not a multiple of 7, hence b cannot be a multiple of 7 in order to satisfy equation (non multiple = Multiple - non-multiple). This means 2b cannot be a multiple of 7. In final step where a+b=2b+7k....(a+b) cannot be a mulitple of 7 (using above rule) cause we adding a multiple and a non-multiple. Phew!....Is this reasoning correct? Thanks amigo!
U r right.
Rahul Lakhani
Quant Expert
Gurome, Inc.
https://www.GuroMe.com
On MBA sabbatical (at ISB) for 2011-12 - will stay active as time permits
1-800-566-4043 (USA)
+91-99201 32411 (India)

User avatar
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:22 am
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Thanked: 1 times

by Dinen » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:19 am
Thanks Rahul and Fiver...tis much appreciated. As an aside to other newbies following this thread.....in the short while that I've started studying for gmat, I find that it is imperative that one understands solutions in terms of your understanding and interpretation of problems and if u try and assimulate concepts that u yourself are not 200% certain about, gmat finds a way of letting u know this.....and therein lies the difficulty of the exam.....just my "full of newbie zest but still ignorant POV" 2 cents worth.....and due to the patience of guys like u, alot of us can overcome this. A fine glass of merlot beckons on this chilly CT evening....so later amigos!
You never too old to grow up

Master | Next Rank: 500 Posts
Posts: 114
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2008 3:51 am
Thanked: 8 times
GMAT Score:680

by Fiver » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:44 am
Dinen wrote:Thanks Rahul and Fiver...tis much appreciated. As an aside to other newbies following this thread.....in the short while that I've started studying for gmat, I find that it is imperative that one understands solutions in terms of your understanding and interpretation of problems and if u try and assimulate concepts that u yourself are not 200% certain about, gmat finds a way of letting u know this.....and therein lies the difficulty of the exam.....just my "full of newbie zest but still ignorant POV" 2 cents worth.....and due to the patience of guys like u, alot of us can overcome this. A fine glass of merlot beckons on this chilly CT evening....so later amigos!
Cheers amigo[/img]