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Tense problem

by yvonne0923 » Wed May 11, 2011 8:26 pm
The prehistoric monument Stonehenge is believed to have been erected around 2200BC, and has attracted the attention of many archeologists, among them John Aubrey, who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids for religious ceremonies.

A. who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
B. who, believing the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
C. who, when he had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
D. who had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
E. believing that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids










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[spoiler]O.A: A[/spoiler]

In choice A, "who believed that..." is simple past tense, but the tense of the rest of sentence is simple present tense.

Thanks,
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by smackmartine » Thu May 12, 2011 11:35 pm
A) Rest of the sentence is in present perfect and emphasis is on object(monument Stonehenge), while the underlined portion is modifying only John Aubrey.Only A does this correctly. All others have some flaws in them.
B) Run on sentence
C) awkward ", when" construction + John Aubrey believed before something happened (the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids)
D) John Aubrey believed before something happened (the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids)
E) ",who" is required
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by atulmangal » Fri May 13, 2011 12:42 am
yvonne0923 wrote:The prehistoric monument Stonehenge is believed to have been erected around 2200BC, and has attracted the attention of many archeologists, among them John Aubrey, who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids for religious ceremonies.

A. who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
B. who, believing the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
C. who, when he had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
D. who had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
E. believing that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids










____________________________________________________________
[spoiler]O.A: A[/spoiler]

In choice A, "who believed that..." is simple past tense, but the tense of the rest of sentence is simple present tense.

Thanks,
I agree with OA op A, but still this is not an official question...is it???? whats the source???
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by Brian@VeritasPrep » Fri May 13, 2011 10:24 am
Great question on the tenses here. Hopefully I'm providing a steady drumbeat these days on this board...the right answer must be LOGICAL but there can be multiple logical words you can use in each situation. Sentence Correction isn't an if---then computer program...it's going to require you to think about the situations.

"Has attracted" represents an ongoing action over time; one that began in the past and has continued through the present. So if we provide one example of the archeologists that Stonehenge "has attracted", we can logically use any period from the past until now. Over that time period, Stonehenge attracted the attention of John Aubrey, who in that time believed X about Stonehenge.

That's not at all different from saying:

The White House has played home to over forty United States presidents, including Abraham Lincoln, who lived there from 1861 to 1865.

Here the use of the simple past tense should be explicitly clear - the sentence provides dates that show that this happened long, long ago and has certainly ceased to happen. So the only logical tense is the simple past tense.

But because "has played home" covers the timeline from past to present, you could also say:

The White House has played home to over forty U.S. presidents, including Barack Obama, who currently resides there with his wife and two children.

Here, we're using the indicative/present tense "lives" because that's the logical verb to use...the sentence says "currently".

What's most important with verb tense decisions in SC problems is that you eliminate illogical verbs - those that give a distorted timeline - and then narrow your search from there.
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by mundasingh123 » Fri May 13, 2011 10:30 am
atulmangal wrote:
yvonne0923 wrote:The prehistoric monument Stonehenge is believed to have been erected around 2200BC, and has attracted the attention of many archeologists, among them John Aubrey, who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids for religious ceremonies.

A. who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
B. who, believing the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
C. who, when he had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
D. who had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
E. believing that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids










____________________________________________________________
[spoiler]O.A: A[/spoiler]

In choice A, "who believed that..." is simple past tense, but the tense of the rest of sentence is simple present tense.

Thanks,
I agree with OA op A, but still this is not an official question...is it???? whats the source???
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by mundasingh123 » Fri May 13, 2011 10:39 am
Brian@VeritasPrep wrote:Great question on the tenses here. Hopefully I'm providing a steady drumbeat these days on this board...the right answer must be LOGICAL but there can be multiple logical words you can use in each situation. Sentence Correction isn't an if---then computer program...it's going to require you to think about the situations.

"Has attracted" represents an ongoing action over time; one that began in the past and has continued through the present. So if we provide one example of the archeologists that Stonehenge "has attracted", we can logically use any period from the past until now. Over that time period, Stonehenge attracted the attention of John Aubrey, who in that time believed X about Stonehenge.

That's not at all different from saying:

The White House has played home to over forty United States presidents, including Abraham Lincoln, who lived there from 1861 to 1865.

Here the use of the simple past tense should be explicitly clear - the sentence provides dates that show that this happened long, long ago and has certainly ceased to happen. So the only logical tense is the simple past tense.

But because "has played home" covers the timeline from past to present, you could also say:

The White House has played home to over forty U.S. presidents, including Barack Obama, who currently resides there with his wife and two children.

Here, we're using the indicative/present tense "lives" because that's the logical verb to use...the sentence says "currently".

What's most important with verb tense decisions in SC problems is that you eliminate illogical verbs - those that give a distorted timeline - and then narrow your search from there.
Hi Brian , whats the official explanation for eliminating D ?
i could tell that the past perfect is used when you need to show that the action precedes some other action and since we dont know what action is the action of believing supposed to precede we remove D
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by yvonne0923 » Fri May 13, 2011 11:17 am
atulmangal wrote:
yvonne0923 wrote:The prehistoric monument Stonehenge is believed to have been erected around 2200BC, and has attracted the attention of many archeologists, among them John Aubrey, who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids for religious ceremonies.

A. who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
B. who, believing the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
C. who, when he had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
D. who had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
E. believing that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids










____________________________________________________________
[spoiler]O.A: A[/spoiler]

In choice A, "who believed that..." is simple past tense, but the tense of the rest of sentence is simple present tense.

Thanks,
I agree with OA op A, but still this is not an official question...is it???? whats the source???
Atul, It's not official question, it is from Veritas SC problems.
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by Brian@VeritasPrep » Fri May 13, 2011 11:24 am
I think you nailed it, Mundasingh!

That past-perfect tense there sets up a really illogical timeline. "Had believed" would set that action back further in the past than the past-tense "was used". Which would mean that:

Before the Druids long-ago used Stonehenge for religious ceremonies, but within the time that Stonehenge was attracting archaeological attention, John Aubrey believed that the Druids would later use Stonehenge for religious ceremonies.

That past-perfect assigned to John's belief puts the belief before the event that he, as an archaeologist who should be looking back into history, believes happened. So that just doesn't work, and D is therefore incorrect.

Nice work!
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by mundasingh123 » Fri May 13, 2011 11:27 am
Brian@VeritasPrep wrote:I think you nailed it, Mundasingh!

That past-perfect tense there sets up a really illogical timeline. "Had believed" would set that action back further in the past than the past-tense "was used". Which would mean that:

Before the Druids long-ago used Stonehenge for religious ceremonies, but within the time that Stonehenge was attracting archaeological attention, John Aubrey believed that the Druids would later use Stonehenge for religious ceremonies.

That past-perfect assigned to John's belief puts the belief before the event that he, as an archaeologist who should be looking back into history, believes happened. So that just doesn't work, and D is therefore incorrect.

Nice work!
Thanks brian for succinctly explaining the interpretation of "past perfect here " in terms of the timeline
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by yvonne0923 » Fri May 13, 2011 11:31 am
Brian@VeritasPrep wrote:I think you nailed it, Mundasingh!

That past-perfect tense there sets up a really illogical timeline. "Had believed" would set that action back further in the past than the past-tense "was used". Which would mean that:

Before the Druids long-ago used Stonehenge for religious ceremonies, but within the time that Stonehenge was attracting archaeological attention, John Aubrey believed that the Druids would later use Stonehenge for religious ceremonies.

That past-perfect assigned to John's belief puts the belief before the event that he, as an archaeologist who should be looking back into history, believes happened. So that just doesn't work, and D is therefore incorrect.

Nice work!
Very nice explanation.
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by GMATMadeEasy » Mon May 16, 2011 2:21 am
@Brian@VeritasPrep: A question from the correct answer choice A

In the underlined part, we do not need past perfect ?

Choice A
who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
If we were to write the site had been used :

who believed that the landscape surrounding the site had been used by the Druids

I can feel it is wrong, but can put in words the logic. Could you share an appropriate way to justify this answer choice. There is a question in OG 12 that uses exactly the same tense sequence (ice age theory one)
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by aspirant2011 » Mon May 16, 2011 9:20 am
The prehistoric monument Stonehenge is believed to have been erected around 2200BC, and has attracted the attention of many archeologists, among them John Aubrey, who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids for religious ceremonies.

A. who believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
B. who, believing the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
C. who, when he had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
D. who had believed that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids -------> sentence says "has attracted" therefore, we can't use past perfect as the action hasn't completed in the past and the person is still there
E. believing that the landscape surrounding the site was used by the Druids
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