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As and like : Proponents of artificial intellegence

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As and like : Proponents of artificial intellegence

by avik.ch » Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:14 am
I have a doubt on the usage of "as" and "like". The usage goes by
- "As" is used for a real relationship and "like" is used for metaphorical relationship. Its a mere meaning issue.
- "Like" is used to compare noouns/noun phrase and "as" is used to compare action/verbs.

MY question is do GMAT follow the first rule ?

Proponents of artificial intelligence say they will be able to make computers that can understand English and other human languages, recognize objects, and reason as an expert does-computers that will be used to diagnose equipment breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan, or other purposes such as these.
(A) as an expert does-computers that will be used to diagnose equipment
breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan, or other purposes such as these
(B) as an expert does, which may be used for purposes such as diagnosing equipment breakdowns or deciding whether to authorize a loan
(C) like an expert-computers that will be used for such purposes as diagnosing equipment breakdowns or deciding whether to authorize a loan
(D) like an expert, the use of which would be for purposes like the diagnosis of equipment breakdowns or the decision whether or not a loan should be authorized
(E) like an expert, to be used to diagnose equipment breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan or not, or the like

As per verbal guide 2nd edition SC(#95) explanation : Both the usage : "like an expert" and "as an expert does" is correct
the correct usage is "like an expert", thought the answer is C but why the explanation goes in this direction ?

It seems that GMAT follow only the second rule about "like" and "as".

Please help.
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by force5 » Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:39 am
C seems better. Like should be used here.
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by force5 » Thu Sep 08, 2011 7:54 am
My apologies... didn't read your complete question. you wanted an explanation... Here it goes..

(A) as an expert does-computers that will be used to diagnose equipment
breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan, or other purposes such as these
Incorrect- to diagnose and deciding are not parallel.

(B) as an expert does, which may be used for purposes such as diagnosing equipment breakdowns or deciding whether to authorize a loan
Incorrect- use of which introduces relative clause, which is incorrect here.

(C) like an expert-computers that will be used for such purposes as diagnosing equipment breakdowns or deciding whether to authorize a loan
Correct- Besides the use of like (as mentioned in my explanation) diagnosing and deciding are parallel too.
(D) like an expert, the use of which would be for purposes like the diagnosis of equipment breakdowns or the decision whether or not a loan should be authorized
Incorrect- the use of which is incorrect here. Its actual modifier "computers" is too far away from it.
(E) like an expert, to be used to diagnose equipment breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan or not, or the like
Incorrect- to be used to diagnose equipment breakdown is- is a dangling modifier because it doesn't have its antecedent.

Now a word on your real problem. As Vs Like . . . . . . . . . . . .

believe me this hurts most of the students.

as per the book the basic difference is that as compares clauses and actions. where as Like compares nouns or phrases. Lets go a little beyond this basic concept.

now consider these two sentences

He played like a genius. (he is not a genius but he played like one)
He played as a genius (he actually is a genius)
this was more to do with the meaning part.

An expert Advice- In my Long experience (with GMAT), i have not seen GMAT actually giving a question in which use of both "as" and "like" is correct and there is no other error in the sentence. (you can search all OG's, Verbal reviews and Gmat prep questions) YOU WILL FIND NONE.
Hence the question will clearly give you split.

Coming back to the question that you have posted---

Clearly, from my examples, "like" should be preferred to "as". moreover, there are other errors too. Hence it will be easier for you to pick the best choice.

Please Let me know or PM me if anyone needs any further clarification on this....
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by avik.ch » Thu Sep 08, 2011 9:09 am
force5 wrote:My apologies... didn't read your complete question. you wanted an explanation... Here it goes..

(A) as an expert does-computers that will be used to diagnose equipment
breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan, or other purposes such as these
Incorrect- to diagnose and deciding are not parallel.

(B) as an expert does, which may be used for purposes such as diagnosing equipment breakdowns or deciding whether to authorize a loan
Incorrect- use of which introduces relative clause, which is incorrect here.

(C) like an expert-computers that will be used for such purposes as diagnosing equipment breakdowns or deciding whether to authorize a loan
Correct- Besides the use of like (as mentioned in my explanation) diagnosing and deciding are parallel too.
(D) like an expert, the use of which would be for purposes like the diagnosis of equipment breakdowns or the decision whether or not a loan should be authorized
Incorrect- the use of which is incorrect here. Its actual modifier "computers" is too far away from it.
(E) like an expert, to be used to diagnose equipment breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan or not, or the like
Incorrect- to be used to diagnose equipment breakdown is- is a dangling modifier because it doesn't have its antecedent.

Now a word on your real problem. As Vs Like . . . . . . . . . . . .

believe me this hurts most of the students.

as per the book the basic difference is that as compares clauses and actions. where as Like compares nouns or phrases. Lets go a little beyond this basic concept.

now consider these two sentences

He played like a genius. (he is not a genius but he played like one)
He played as a genius (he actually is a genius)
this was more to do with the meaning part.

An expert Advice- In my Long experience (with GMAT), i have not seen GMAT actually giving a question in which use of both "as" and "like" is correct and there is no other error in the sentence. (you can search all OG's, Verbal reviews and Gmat prep questions) YOU WILL FIND NONE.
Hence the question will clearly give you split.

Coming back to the question that you have posted---

Clearly, from my examples, "like" should be preferred to "as". moreover, there are other errors too. Hence it will be easier for you to pick the best choice.

Please Let me know or PM me if anyone needs any further clarification on this....
Thanks for your clarification.
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by VivianKerr » Thu Sep 08, 2011 9:28 am
I agree! There are idiomatic differences with "like" and "as" and ways in which each is "typically" used, but I too have never seen an SC where this was a concept expressly-tested. If it comes up in an SC, there is another important difference between the answer choices.
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by e-GMAT » Thu Sep 08, 2011 9:58 am
Interesting discussion. Rather a very common discussion point. Coincidentally, I covered this question in my live session just yesterday!!

force5 has given a very good assessment of like vs as. Here is a summary of the usage and a handy framework.

Usage
1: Like and As are used to state comparisons.
2: Like is used to compare NOUNS - Like entity A, entity B does xyz
3: As is used to compare actions/clauses - As entity A does, entity B does xyz

In certain cases the meaning of 2 = 3 but in certain other cases the meaning of 2 is different from the meaning of 3.

Case when meaning of 2 = 3
While watching her favorite show, the baby concentrates like an adult.
While watching her favorite show, the baby concentrates as an adult does.

Case when meaning of 2 is different from meaning of 3
The participant on American Idol performed like Celine Dion.
The participant on the dance show performed as Celine Dion performs.

Does GMAT test this different in meaning?
I have not seen evidence of that. That is - I have not seen an official sentence in which the two sentences above will be two choices and you would be asked to select the correct one. Both are correct but they communicate slightly different meaning.

Does the above mean that "As" cannot be followed by a noun?
No it does not mean that. The above implies that "as" cannot be followed by a noun when you want to state a comparison. As can very well be followed by a noun if you want to state the meaning "in the role of" or "function".

This brings us to another usage of As
Usage of As to show "function"
As role, entity A does xyz
Here A = role

As your teacher, I have the responsibility to impart knowledge to my students.
This sentence implies that "I am your teacher".

Note here - in this sentence, there is no comparison. The meaning of the sentence is that "I am your teacher..."

Framework
Step 1 - What is the intended meaning of the sentence? Does the sentence intend to communicate a comparison or does it intend to state that x plays the role of y.
Step 2 - If the comparison is to be stated then ensure that it is stated using one of the following ways:
Like + NOUN
As + CLAUSE

If the intended meaning is to show "role" or "function", then use the expression:
As + Noun

(Note that there are other uses of "As" as well - to indicate "during or while" or to indicate "reason". But these usages do not cause confusion with the usage of like.)

How does this Framework apply to this question?

Step 1 - Meaning of the Sentence:

Proponents of artificial intelligence say they will be able to make computers that can understand English and other human languages, recognize objects, and reason as an expert does-computers that will be used to diagnose equipment breakdowns, deciding whether to authorize a loan, or other purposes such as these.

Sentence talks about what the AI will make possible. Computers will be able to ....reason as an expert does....It is not logical to say that computers will play role of expert. The logical meaning here is the comparison - Computers and experts are being compared.

Step 2 - Correct expression
In the context of this sentence, both are correct:
Computers will be able to reason like an expert
Computers will be able to reason as an expert does

Thus, in this question even though there is a pretty clear split in the answer choices - like an expert or "as an expert does", this difference cannot be used to eliminate any answer choice.

Few other Official Questions:
GMATPrep
As with those of humans, the DNA of grape plants contains sites where certain unique sequences of nucleotides are repeated over and over.
A: As with those of humans, the DNA of grape plants contains sites where
B: As human DNA, the DNA of grape plants contain sites in which
C: As it is with human DNA, the DNA of grape plants, containing sites in which
D: Like human, the DNA of grape plants contain sites where
E: Like human DNA, the DNA of grape plants contains sites in which

In this sentence as well, the intended meaning is the "COMPARISON". Once you know this, you would know that choice B is incorrect.

Verbal Review Question 32
Like Rousseau, Tolstoi rebelled against...
A: Like Rousseau, Tolstoi rebelled
C: As Rousseau, Tolstoi rebelled

In this sentence as well, the intended meaning is the "COMPARISON". Once you know this, you would know right away to eliminate choice C.

But now lets assume the sentence were a little different:
Tolstoi was appointed union leader by the commission of workers, and like their leader, he rebelled against...
A: like their leader
B: as their leader does
C: as their union leader

Now in this sentence, the context indicates that Tolstoi is actually the Union leader. So the intended meaning here is "FUNCTION" or "ROLE". Thus, the correct usage is "as their leader". Choice C is correct here. A and B are not correct.

TAKE-AWAY
Always understand the intended meaning of the sentence.
Comparison can be expressed in two ways - Like + NOUN and As + CLAUSE
If the meaning is "in the role of", then you must use the expression - AS + NOUN

Hope this helps :)

Payal
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by missionGMATverbal » Fri Sep 09, 2011 7:40 am
Thanks Payal for this great analysis. This post along with the application in this https://www.beatthegmat.com/sc-like-meta ... tml#404416 post has made this like vs as confusing thing very clear. I always struggled with this concept. Hopefully I can apply this framework on official questions.
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by mundasingh123 » Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:56 am
Case when meaning of 2 is different from meaning of 3
The participant on American Idol performed like Celine Dion.
The participant on the dance show performed as Celine Dion performs.
Payal, Could you please explain the difference between the 2 sentences . Both amount to saying the same thing IMO
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by bubbliiiiiiii » Sun Sep 11, 2011 10:21 pm
Just wanted to pitch in to receive updates on the question asked. :)
Regards,

Pranay
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by mundasingh123 » Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:46 am
bubbliiiiiiii wrote:Just wanted to pitch in to receive updates on the question asked. :)
You see the watch topic button below next to post reply
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by mundasingh123 » Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:47 am
bubbliiiiiiii wrote:Just wanted to pitch in to receive updates on the question asked. :)
Thanks for bumping the thread i lost the plot .
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