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shuttle and space station

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shuttle and space station

by nh8404052006 » Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:14 pm
Unlike the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which carried sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries, a permanently orbiting space station will have to generate its own electricity.

A: the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which carried sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries
B: the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, with sufficient enough power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights
C: the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which enabled them to carry sufficient enough power in fuel cells and batteries
D: the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which were capable of carrying sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights
E: the flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, whose shortness allowed them to carry sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries

OA: D
Why Not: B

Please explain, thank
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Re: shuttle and space station

by iamcste » Mon Apr 06, 2009 1:19 am
nh8404052006 wrote:Unlike the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which carried sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries, a permanently orbiting space station will have to generate its own electricity.

A: the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which carried sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries
B: the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, with sufficient enough power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights
C: the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which enabled them to carry sufficient enough power in fuel cells and batteries
D: the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which were capable of carrying sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights
E: the flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, whose shortness allowed them to carry sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries

OA: D
Why Not: B

Please explain, thank
Set17Q30
B v/s D

Sufficient and enough are redundant. "with..." looked awkward to me

Also, D modifiers and Subject verb agreement is correct.
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Re: shuttle and space station

by lunarpower » Sun Oct 04, 2009 10:54 am
(1) sufficient + enough is REDUNDANT. redundancy is very bad.
same reason you wouldn't say "reply back", "added bonus", or "determined as a result of" (see #138 in OG11, if you have that).

(2) make sure you know that "enough THAT" is incorrect.

there are two correct idioms with "enough":
* enough to VERB (or enough NOUN to VERB, or ADJ enough to VERB)
* enough for...
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by CaptainM » Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:28 am
lunarpower wrote:(1) sufficient + enough is REDUNDANT. redundancy is very bad.
same reason you wouldn't say "reply back", "added bonus", or "determined as a result of" (see #138 in OG11, if you have that).

(2) make sure you know that "enough THAT" is incorrect.

there are two correct idioms with "enough":
* enough to VERB (or enough NOUN to VERB, or ADJ enough to VERB)
* enough for...
Ron

Could you please explain why the usage of capable is right in the OA?
I thought able/capable is used only for living things.

"the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which were capable of carrying sufficient power in
fuel cells and batteries"
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by lunarpower » Thu Sep 30, 2010 3:03 am
CaptainM wrote:
lunarpower wrote:(1) sufficient + enough is REDUNDANT. redundancy is very bad.
same reason you wouldn't say "reply back", "added bonus", or "determined as a result of" (see #138 in OG11, if you have that).

(2) make sure you know that "enough THAT" is incorrect.

there are two correct idioms with "enough":
* enough to VERB (or enough NOUN to VERB, or ADJ enough to VERB)
* enough for...
Ron

Could you please explain why the usage of capable is right in the OA?
I thought able/capable is used only for living things.

"the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, which were capable of carrying sufficient power in
fuel cells and batteries"
i think i wrote that earlier, since it was my original suspicion upon looking at some other problem. however, this problem shows that the use of the word "capable" is somewhat more general than i had previously thought. therefore, i'm going to suggest a new rule:
it seems that the word "capable" can be legitimately used not only for humans and animals, but also for any other object that may be reasonably described as having powers or abilities -- in particular, machines.

under this definition, then, a lot more things could be described as "capable". for instance, it would become legitimate to say something like This single picture is capable of changing people's lives.
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by JerryV » Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:23 pm
Can anyone explain why option A is wrong?

B. eliminated as sufficient enough is redundant.
C. which enabled them to carry, wordy.
D. which carried sufficient power of option A sounded more concise than which were capable of carrying sufficient power of option D.
E. whose shortness allowed them to carry, wordy and awkward.
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by lunarpower » Thu Sep 29, 2011 4:08 am
JerryV wrote:Can anyone explain why option A is wrong?
option (a) is wrong for the same reason why options (c) and (e) are: incorrect comparison.

all three of those choices have some version of the following comparison:
Unlike the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, xxxxxxxxx more modifiers xxxxxxxxx, a permanently orbiting space station...
... so, you are comparing the flights of the shuttle and other spacecraft -- i.e., not the shuttle/spacecraft themselves -- with the space station. that's not a logical comparison.
only (b) and (d) make a reasonable comparison (between the shuttle and space craft themselves and the space station itself).

--

by the way -- there may be choices that are "wordy" or "awkward"... but, two things:

(1) if you are eliminating several choices only on the basis of their being "wordy" and/or "awkward", then you should definitely review those problems more thoroughly. wordiness and awkwardness are not actually errors -- although you won't generally find them incorrect answers -- so, if a problem contains them, then you should try to find an actual error in your review of those problems.

(2) most people can get a handle on wordiness (you don't have to judge it absolutely -- all you have to do is notice when one choice is considerably clunkier than another one). however, "awkwardness" is very difficult for non-native speakers to detect. therefore, if english is your native language, then go ahead and use whatever instinct you may have about awkwardness; if you are not a native speaker, on the other hand, then awkwardness is not something you're going to grasp very easily.
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by JerryV » Thu Sep 29, 2011 6:19 am
Thanks Ron, I did not notice the comparison element in the sentence. Once I realized that, D was the only logical option.
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by sachindia » Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:03 am
Unlike the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, with sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights , a permanently orbiting space station will have to generate its own electricity.

Hi Sir Ron,

' Sufficient enough ' is redundant for sure but is there any other mistake in that option? I have removed the 'enough' from the answer choice and posted above.

Please let me know if this construct is grammatically correct.
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by lunarpower » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:03 am
sachindia wrote:Unlike the short flights of the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, with sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights , a permanently orbiting space station will have to generate its own electricity.

Hi Sir Ron,

' Sufficient enough ' is redundant for sure but is there any other mistake in that option? I have removed the 'enough' from the answer choice and posted above.

Please let me know if this construct is grammatically correct.
even if you make that correction, you still end up with a sentence that compares "the short flights..." to "a permanently orbiting space station". that's not a logical comparison.
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by sachindia » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:12 am
sorry Sir, my bad.. what I actually meant to ask is if the following would be grammatically correct

Unlike the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, with sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights , a permanently orbiting space station will have to generate its own electricity.
Regards,
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by lunarpower » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:18 am
sachindia wrote:sorry Sir, my bad.. what I actually meant to ask is if the following would be grammatically correct

Unlike the shuttle and earlier spacecraft, with sufficient power in fuel cells and batteries for their short flights , a permanently orbiting space station will have to generate its own electricity.
nope -- you've still got a tense problem in that one.

the only tensed verb in that sentence is "will have to..." -- meaning that the sentence is talking about a future event, from a present point of view.
that part isn't a problem, but it creates an issue in the other part of the sentence, which talks about earlier spacecraft (i.e., spacecraft that don't exist anymore).
the problem is that, by implication, the whole sentence is still in the present -- wrongly implying that the "short flights" [of the earlier spacecraft] are things that still happen in the present timeframe.

by contrast, take a look at the correct answer, in which a past-tense construction ("which were capable...") is properly used to demarcate that separate timeframe.

--

most importantly -- don't try to edit the sentences!
it should already be enough of a challenge to evaluate whether the choices in front of you are right or wrong. that's the only thing you actually have to do, so it's best to stay focused on that.
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by sachindia » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:24 am
Thanks a lot Ron Sir.
From your post, I understand that there's no grammatical error but a meaning error..
Regards,
Sach
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