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The Wallerstein study

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The Wallerstein study

by goelmohit2002 » Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:40 am
Hi All,

In the below question, Can someone please tell what OG mean to say for the reason to kick out E ? I am not able to understand the highlighted portion of the reason to kick out E....Does it mean that each can not refer to plural noun in GMAT ?


Choice E includes an incorrect verb tense (has occurred) and wrongly replaces when with as. Also, "each was" does not properly refer to men and women.

=============================================
The Wallerstein study indicates that even after a decade young men and women still experience some of the effects of a divorce occurring when a child.
(A) occurring when a child
(B) occurring when children
(C) that occurred when a child
(D) that occurred when they were children
(E) that has occurred as each was a child

OA = D
Last edited by goelmohit2002 on Sun Aug 02, 2009 6:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Wallerstein study

by cata1yst » Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:58 am
goelmohit2002 wrote:Hi All,

In the below question, Can someone please tell what OG mean to say for the reason to kick out E ? I am not able to understand the highlighted portion of the reason to kick out E....Does it mean that each can not refer to plural noun in GMAT ?


Choice E includes an incorrect verb tense (has occurred) and wrongly replaces when with as. Also, "each was" does not properly refer to men and women.

=============================================
The Wallerstein study indicates that even after a decade young men and women still experience some of the effects of a divorce occurring when a child.
(A) occurring when a child
(B) occurring when children
(C) that occurred when a child
(D) that occurred when they were children
(E) that has occurred as each was a child

OA = D
D.

Need the past tense so A and B out.

C is out because "child" doesn't refer to men and women. Need children.

E is out because "as each was" is poor. And "each"/"child" is singular. Need to refer back to men and women.

D. does this.
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Re: The Wallerstein study

by goelmohit2002 » Tue Jul 21, 2009 12:09 pm
cata1yst wrote: E is out because "as each was" is poor. And "each"/"child" is singular. Need to refer back to men and women.
Please note that OG does not talk about child + men/women issue with E....as opposed to A and C....where OG clearly say that child + men/women cannot go together...

in E...OG specifically say that men/women + each was cannot go together....

Can someone please tell what does OG mean to say here ?
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by Stacey Koprince » Wed Jul 29, 2009 1:21 pm
Received a PM asking me to respond. Not the best official explanation I've ever read.

The phrase used in the sentence is "men and women" - consider that one unit. When you later use "each" to refer back, you are actually referring back to that whole unit. So we've got "each man-and-woman-as-a-unit" (or maybe as a pair) - but the meaning you'd really want with each is "each man" and "each woman."

Luckily, there are other great reasons to eliminate E, so we don't have to worry about the fuzziness of that "each" thing too much. It's not a mistake that there were other, better reasons to eliminate in the same choice. I don't think they'd have given us an option on this one with everything correct except for that "each" thing.
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by goelmohit2002 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 10:29 am
Stacey Koprince wrote:Received a PM asking me to respond. Not the best official explanation I've ever read.

The phrase used in the sentence is "men and women" - consider that one unit. When you later use "each" to refer back, you are actually referring back to that whole unit. So we've got "each man-and-woman-as-a-unit" (or maybe as a pair) - but the meaning you'd really want with each is "each man" and "each woman."

Luckily, there are other great reasons to eliminate E, so we don't have to worry about the fuzziness of that "each" thing too much. It's not a mistake that there were other, better reasons to eliminate in the same choice. I don't think they'd have given us an option on this one with everything correct except for that "each" thing.
Thanks a lot Stacey.

Can you please tell why using "As" is wrong in option E....as said by OG....OG says we should use "when" instead....Can you please help understand the reasoning behind the same ?

Also can you please help understand what does OG mean to say for Kicking out option A.....

OG says "Choice A incorrectly introduces the when... phrase with occurring, thus illogically making divorce the grammatical referent of when a child;"

Can you please tell what is meant by the above ?
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by Stacey Koprince » Thu Jul 30, 2009 1:29 pm
In E, it says "<something> occurred as each was a child."

In other words, the "something" occurred as something else was going on - simultaneously. But we're not trying to say there were two different actions taking place simultaneously.

The earthquake occurred as I hummed. Okay, now this is actually two simultaneous actions.

Vs. when - we use "when" just to indicate a certain state or period of time. "When I was a child" is a specific period of time.

In A, "divorce occurring when a child" - I'm not sure I totally buy the wording of their explanation, but for a second, it does sound like the child is getting divorced. And that's obviously (hopefully!) illogical.
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by goelmohit2002 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 8:16 pm
Stacey Koprince wrote:In A, "divorce occurring when a child" - I'm not sure I totally buy the wording of their explanation, but for a second, it does sound like the child is getting divorced. And that's obviously (hopefully!) illogical.
Thanks Stacey!!!

Can you please give your view of kicking out A and B.....let's forget about the OG stuff :-)

Can you please tell how does A and B make you sound like child is getting divorced.....to my ear I am not able to hear anything like that :-) ?

Thanks Again
Mohit
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by Stacey Koprince » Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:03 am
What are the long-term effects of a bad injury occurring when a child?

Given the above sentence, would you expect the "bad injury" to happen to the child? Eg, a child is running, falls, and breaks her ankle.

Or would you expect the injury to be someone else close to the child? Another child in the school yard is running, falls, and breaks his ankle. If you then wanted to ask what effect that would have on a *different* child, would you say, "What are the effects of a bad injury occurring <to one child> when a <different> child?"

To some extent, the first sentence I typed above makes me want to ask "when a child what?" eg, what are the effects of a bad injury occurring when a child falls?

And that actually helps me to see what's wrong with this set-up. The general expectation from this set-up would be that the child in question was involved in the event itself. That's why I want to ask "when a child what?"

Similarly, although we know (hope!) children aren't getting divorced, the juxtaposition of those words makes it sound like the child was participating in the event, not just being affected by something that happened. (Same thing for plural, as in choice B.)
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by Onell » Wed Nov 10, 2010 8:31 am
Stacey Koprince wrote:What are the long-term effects of a bad injury occurring when a child?

Given the above sentence, would you expect the "bad injury" to happen to the child? Eg, a child is running, falls, and breaks her ankle.

Or would you expect the injury to be someone else close to the child? Another child in the school yard is running, falls, and breaks his ankle. If you then wanted to ask what effect that would have on a *different* child, would you say, "What are the effects of a bad injury occurring <to one child> when a <different> child?"

To some extent, the first sentence I typed above makes me want to ask "when a child what?" eg, what are the effects of a bad injury occurring when a child falls?

And that actually helps me to see what's wrong with this set-up. The general expectation from this set-up would be that the child in question was involved in the event itself. That's why I want to ask "when a child what?"

Similarly, although we know (hope!) children aren't getting divorced, the juxtaposition of those words makes it sound like the child was participating in the event, not just being affected by something that happened. (Same thing for plural, as in choice B.)

Hi ,
Og 10 says Choice b incorrectly introduces the when... phrase with occurring, thus illogically making divorce the grammatical referent of when a child . .
I thought occurring when a child as a participle phrase that modifies divorce , thus selected option B. Can anyone tell me what is wrong with this construction, and elaborate what OG is trying to say?
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