BREAKING: Target Test Prep releases Brand New 2026 On Demand GMAT prep course

Redeem

SHOULD I WAIT FOR R3? (EUROPEAN schools)

Free advice from the world's top MBA consultants
This topic has expert replies
Post new topic Post Reply
Previous Topic Next Topic
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 11:25 pm

SHOULD I WAIT FOR R3? (EUROPEAN schools)

by n2739178 » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:03 pm
Hello

MY profile:
* 7 years in business intelligence (data management, information management, business analysis, business analytics)
* currently work for a specialised business intelligence consultancy with strong links to Microsoft
* Have worked in internet gaming (sports betting etc.), banking, internet advertising, energy, mining, waste management)
* 29 years old, 30 this december
* lived and worked in Australia, Malta, United Kingdom
* GMAT should be around 700 to 710 (taking in 3 days!)
* Target schools: LBS, OXFORD, HEC PARIS, TUCK
* Australian GPA 4.5 out of 7 (but I failed one subject twice due to personal circumstances - however I now work in that exact area that I failed and have been doing so for 5 years)
* Zero recent extracurriculars apart from travelling around Europe when I can, cycling, jogging, diving, getting motorbike license soon

I'm wondering if I should wait until R3 to apply? I don't think my application will be 100% ready by January 5th when most R2 deadlines are due... and I'm not 100% sure if I should even apply this year, and spend the next year really boosting my profile (learning a language, take a statistics class, doing extracurriculars)

In Europe there are normally 4 rounds, R4 is pretty impossible to get in. R3 is semi-realistic.
My question is, should I wait for R3 and submit stellar applications and a very strong GMAT?

Or take my chances in R2?

My concern is that if I apply in R3 and get rejected, then it is only 6 months before R1 comes around again...

I really don't know what to do - should I delay my application for 1 year or go for R2/R3?

thanks!
Top
Source: — Ask an MBA Admissions Consultant |
User avatar
Legendary Member
Posts: 795
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:41 am
Thanked: 177 times
Followed by:85 members

by essaysnark » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:43 pm
Oooh n2739178 -- we're so glad you asked!

You should EITHER:
- apply in the January round (most US schools call this "round 2" but the round number matters less than the timing)
OR
- wait till next year Round 1

The schools on your list generally prefer older students, Tuck and LBS in particular -- but "older" in this context means 28 or 29. You can also be "too old" for a standard F/T program. You're almost heading into the Executive MBA territory in terms of how much work experience you have. In terms of age, you're still in the target for a F/T program, but you're starting to creep onto the high side. We think that this would be the right year for you to apply for any of the top full-time programs. The European programs trend older than US in general (not all of them - some trend significantly younger but that's the exception). It may be a little less urgent to go for this year at one of those.

Here's an article about that: https://essaysnark.blocked/.../why- ... -game.html

And here's an article about why you do not want to apply in Rd 3 - basically, for exactly the reason you already mentioned!! https://essaysnark.blocked/2011/02/ ... l-now.html

In terms of will you be ready for Rd 2 - that's an important question. If you won't be able to develop solid essays by January, then absolutely, don't bother applying, it'll just be a waste of money and guaranteed heartache. Personally, we'd recommend skipping it until Rd 1 next season instead of trying for last round at any program, but sometimes schools have more room than they expect at that stage and you never know; some people do always get in through a last-round app each and every year. We wouldn't bank on it at all for LBS nor for Tuck, but you *might* have some luck with Oxford or HEC, since both are marginally less competitive than the others. It's hard to say... In all cases, the essays do require significant time/effort, and so being realistic about what you can pull off, as you're clearly being, is important.

Much of this of course depends on what happens with that GMAT in 3 days!! Hopefully you will in fact hit the 700-mark; that's an unofficial "safety zone" for us. If you don't have a strong GMAT, then we absolutely would recommend pushing everything off till next year instead.

OK... this is running long and we doubt we're helping much...! If there's anything else we can try and tackle for you, let us know!
EssaySnark

PS: You have a really interesting profile - we didn't even go into all that but based on this brief sketch, we're seeing a LOT of cool stuff that the adcoms may respond positively to - it all comes down to stellar essays of course!!!
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
https://essaysnark.com/bookstore/
* * * * * * *
The Indians' Guide to Getting In maps out everything you need to evaluate your own profile and select your schools. https://essaysnark.com/ssguide/quicksnar ... ans-guide/
* * * * * * *
MILITARY CANDIDATES! We've got some pro bono offers just for you: https://essaysnark.com/military-mba/
* * * * * * *
Follow EssaySnark on Twitter!
Top
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 11:25 pm

by n2739178 » Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:52 am
thanks for your reply

I'm just concerned about delaying until next year only because of my age... but if I can boost my profile significantly in the next 10-11 months, then I will be able to apply to European schools who tend to seem to accept older students more readily.

I'm starting to panic a little bit about this actually, i.e. my age, and trying to reach the R2 deadlines. I have struggled with the GMAT for a year and didn't think I'd be in this situation now - I aimed to have it done by now.

I don't really want to do an EMBA at all because 1) I haven't been a manager before and 2) i want to do a full time MBA to enable a career change and 3) I want the full time experience.

I guess I'll hold out to see how my GMAT goes on Tuesday. If it is good then I will have time to do those essays properly. Otherwise I'll delay until next year and aim for a stellar GMAT.
Top
User avatar
Legendary Member
Posts: 795
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:41 am
Thanked: 177 times
Followed by:85 members

by essaysnark » Sun Nov 13, 2011 9:09 am
Hey n2739178 --

At 29/30, you're not too old - though you do have more work experience than average. You're right, you don't seem quite like you're in EMBA territory yet, and definitely the F/T MBA is a different experience.

Maybe just break down the strategy into one or two schools now for January, maybe for the US schools which like 'em younger, and see what happens? You should know if you're getting interview invites within 4-6 weeks of applying, which would be enough time to possibly pull together a Rd 3 app for a European school. But you also might want to hold one school in your "back pocket" as a just-in-case strategy (here's an explanation: https://30days.hoop.la/displaycontent/co ... 0198229094 )

You're not "too old" :-) - it's probably the right time to apply now, so just take it step by step!

And good luck on Tuesday!
EssaySnark
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
https://essaysnark.com/bookstore/
* * * * * * *
The Indians' Guide to Getting In maps out everything you need to evaluate your own profile and select your schools. https://essaysnark.com/ssguide/quicksnar ... ans-guide/
* * * * * * *
MILITARY CANDIDATES! We've got some pro bono offers just for you: https://essaysnark.com/military-mba/
* * * * * * *
Follow EssaySnark on Twitter!
Top
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 11:25 pm

by n2739178 » Sun Nov 13, 2011 10:50 am
thanks!

Not sure I'll get an amazing GMAT. more like 700 (q44 v40) if I'm lucky.... will that offset an average GPA with hardly any quantitative subjects?
Top
User avatar
Legendary Member
Posts: 795
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:41 am
Thanked: 177 times
Followed by:85 members

by essaysnark » Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:56 am
A 700 GMAT score is totally fine for many candidates - the purpose of the GMAT is to prove you can handle the material at bschool, and a 700 generally does indicate that. However, a 44 quant is low for most top bschools. The distribution you cited is obviously weighted more towards verbal, which is fine but could add to the questions around your quant strength. If you don't have much quant coursework on your transcript, then yes, the school will look for evidence of quant ability elsewhere, particularly through that GMAT score -- but that 44 target might not be enough. You will want to emphasize your on-the-job experience with quant-based work in your essays and even have your recommenders talk about your proficiency with concrete examples. Depending on the school you may be hunky dory - again, the 700 overall score would be fabulous in many cases. Much of this will gear off of what your past experience is and also what your goals are (and, which school).

Sorry that we can't be more precise - the schools weigh all the factors, so you're right to be analyzing these elements as you are!!

EssaySnark
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
https://essaysnark.com/bookstore/
* * * * * * *
The Indians' Guide to Getting In maps out everything you need to evaluate your own profile and select your schools. https://essaysnark.com/ssguide/quicksnar ... ans-guide/
* * * * * * *
MILITARY CANDIDATES! We've got some pro bono offers just for you: https://essaysnark.com/military-mba/
* * * * * * *
Follow EssaySnark on Twitter!
Top
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 11:25 pm

by n2739178 » Sun Nov 13, 2011 1:15 pm
thanks again!

I will try Oxford and Cambridge and see how that goes... otherwise I guess delaying 1 year and really working on a very good profile in the next 10 months is probably my best bet...

on that note, how do you recommend I boost my profile? Apart from taking some quant courses at the local university, should I try applying the skills I've learnt in a volunteer role, try to take on leadership roles at work (if they present themselves) etc.?
Top
User avatar
Legendary Member
Posts: 795
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:41 am
Thanked: 177 times
Followed by:85 members

by essaysnark » Sun Nov 13, 2011 7:46 pm
n2739178 wrote:how do you recommend I boost my profile? Apart from taking some quant courses at the local university, should I try applying the skills I've learnt in a volunteer role, try to take on leadership roles at work (if they present themselves) etc.?
Yes, yes, and yes!! You basically just named the three things we recommend to anyone who'll listen! :wink:

Making an impact in a chariable organization can be a very nice way to differentiate your profile. That alone would never get someone admitted to a top program, however it can add a nice dimension to the background, and it also can possibly present good topics for admissions essays. Same thing with the work scenario: look for ways to be a leader, suggest a project for improvement and get appointed to lead it, make something happen! These are things that adcoms everywhere value.

Good luck and keep us posted!
EssaySnark
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
https://essaysnark.com/bookstore/
* * * * * * *
The Indians' Guide to Getting In maps out everything you need to evaluate your own profile and select your schools. https://essaysnark.com/ssguide/quicksnar ... ans-guide/
* * * * * * *
MILITARY CANDIDATES! We've got some pro bono offers just for you: https://essaysnark.com/military-mba/
* * * * * * *
Follow EssaySnark on Twitter!
Top

GMAT/MBA Expert

User avatar
Elite Legendary Member
Posts: 3135
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:55 am
Location: Everywhere
Thanked: 589 times
Followed by:332 members

by Jon@Admissionado » Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:11 am
So.. how did it go?
"Hands down the best MBA admissions consulting firm of all-time, and boy, what an incredible founder!" -- Raj Patil, Founder of Admissionado

Something for everyone:
https://admissionado.lpages.co/admissio ... nter-2018/
https://admissionado.lpages.co/50-essay ... ked-vol-4/
https://admissionado.lpages.co/case-studies-lp/
https://admissionado.com/mba/reviews/
https://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Admis ... 700945.htm

Reach out, and let's gab. Our only requirement is that you don't prefer warm milk over cold milk. Everyone else, 100% welcome.
Email: [email protected]
Phone: 866-409-4753
Hit us up on WhatsApp.
Ping our satellite: 0884#&@-2#101101
Contact us via web form you lazy git: https://admissionado.com/contact/
Mostly, email Claudia.
Top
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 11:25 pm

by n2739178 » Tue Nov 15, 2011 6:39 am
Just got back from the test centre... Bombed it. 580 (q37 v33).

btw my last GMATPrep was 640 (q42 v33) which I took one week ago, my verbal is normally at v40-42 and my last 2 quants before that were q44.

I think I know why I bombed it:
* I'm really burnt out and exhausted from it all at the moment. In the past 2 weeks I've done zero prep, I just didn't have it in me.
* had a very early start - the exam was at 845am, 1 hour from my home. I'm not a morning person.
* Not much sleep last night.
* Became very tired during verbal and couldn't concentrate at all in the 2nd half of it.
* I just wasn't ready, and I knew it. I should have listened to my intuition more...

Anyways I am off back home to Australia tomorrow for a 2.5 week holiday, I may just do 1 hour a day max on weak areas whilst I'm away and then get back into it again when I get back... when I get back though I only have 4 weeks until R2 deadlines... Should I just postpone applying until next year? or am I close to that 700 (with a quant of 47-50 ideally)?

I really don't know what to do at this stage to improve and get "back on the GMAT horse".. I've used most of the MGMAT CAT's and have done most of OG12... Any advice?
Top
User avatar
Legendary Member
Posts: 795
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:41 am
Thanked: 177 times
Followed by:85 members

by essaysnark » Tue Nov 15, 2011 6:54 am
Oh no n2739178!!

Unfortunately this is a common story - many people do much worse on the actual day-of than on practice tests, and it can be VERY discouraging. It sounds like you did an appopriate post-mortem and there were many contributing factors. We're very sorry to hear about this test result though!!

Unfortunately we cannot recommend that you proceed with any of these target schools with a score that's off this much. Even a score in the mid-600s is a tough proposition for the schools on your list. We hate to say it but yes, it sounds like you're going to be in a stronger position if you regroup and make a fresh start in a few months, for the next season of admissions. It's really really hard to do both test prep and essays at the same time, and if you were to have a real go of it for Rd 2 apps then you would need to be switching focus to those essays within the next week or so.

We do like the idea of sticking with the test prep momentum that you have now in order to retest in the near future - sometimes people drop it entirely after a low score and it is MUCH more difficult to pick things up again from scratch down the road.

Again, real sorry to hear about this outcome - it happens frequently though and we know how disappointing it is. The importance of the test cannot be overstated - as they say, a high score won't guarantee admission, but a low score can keep you out, and you are not in a good range yet with the test result today if you want to make it to one of these top-ranked programs.

Please keep us posted - we're cheering for you!

EssaySnark
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
https://essaysnark.com/bookstore/
* * * * * * *
The Indians' Guide to Getting In maps out everything you need to evaluate your own profile and select your schools. https://essaysnark.com/ssguide/quicksnar ... ans-guide/
* * * * * * *
MILITARY CANDIDATES! We've got some pro bono offers just for you: https://essaysnark.com/military-mba/
* * * * * * *
Follow EssaySnark on Twitter!
Top
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 11:25 pm

by n2739178 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 2:20 pm
hi again,

well... i've had a very long mba application process... it's 1 year on and I'm retaking the gmat in 2 weeks. I've got tutoring etcf. recently after struggling with it since last year and finally my scores have improved a fair bit.

unfortunately, this means I have 1 month until my applications are due. I'm not sure I'm going to be able to do the GMAT and submit quality applications in time.

I have a problem - I'm 31 in 3 weeks. I'm under a huge amount of stress as I feel I have this one shot at it now and then I'll be labelled "too old for an MBA" by the schools I'm targeting (Stanford, LBS, INSEAD).

Should I wait until a later round, or even wait until next year and go crazy building up my profile with extracurriculars, volunteering, quant classes etc.? Or is my age really against me now?

thanks
Top
User avatar
Legendary Member
Posts: 795
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:41 am
Thanked: 177 times
Followed by:85 members

by essaysnark » Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:11 am
The last round at any school is super competitive. Not recommended.

31 is not "too old" if your profile is impressive and you have a good reason for why now is the right time. Your list of schools is of course very ambitious. If you're serious about bschool, you may want to look at other targets that are more accommodating to a variety of factors in the profile.

It sounds like once again, all depends on the GMAT, so same advice applies as last year: Take the test and see where you stand from there.

Good luck with it!

EssaySnark
EssaySnark has MBA application guides for HBS, Stanford, Booth, Wharton, NYU and pretty much any other school you can name - including a fully revised and expanded 2015 Columbia essay guide!
https://essaysnark.com/bookstore/
* * * * * * *
The Indians' Guide to Getting In maps out everything you need to evaluate your own profile and select your schools. https://essaysnark.com/ssguide/quicksnar ... ans-guide/
* * * * * * *
MILITARY CANDIDATES! We've got some pro bono offers just for you: https://essaysnark.com/military-mba/
* * * * * * *
Follow EssaySnark on Twitter!
Top
Junior | Next Rank: 30 Posts
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 11:25 pm

by n2739178 » Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:05 pm
wow thanks for the quick reply!

i should get around 680-700 on the GMAT this time as my practice test have been around 680-700 with a quant of 45... i know the quant's not great but i don't have a choice right now as time is limited!

yeah i am also applying for Oxford and Cambridge as they are Top 20-25 as opposed to top 10.

im glad to heaer 31 is not too old... if i have a good profile.

thanks!
Top
Post new topic Post Reply
• Page 1 of 1