Sentence Correction

Hi Ron,
I had considered myself good with the modifier concepts before I saw the below question. This question is from the manhattan's fourth edition sentence correction guide.


Although William Pereira first gained national recognition for his movie set designs, including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations remember him as the architect of the Transamerica Tower, the Malibu campus of Pepperdine University, and the city of Irvine.

(A) including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
(B) like that for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations will
(C) like those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
(D) including that for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
will
(E) including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
will


The answer to this question is given as E.

If we evaluate this question in the light of verb+ing modifier concept, do you think that
the word 'including' should precede by a 'comma'?

I think 'including' is a present participle here and here it is intended to modify only the noun
'movie set designs' but for that to be true it shouldn't be preceded by a 'comma'.

If the 'ing participle' comes after the clause and separated from the clause with a 'comma'
it modifies the whole clause or the verb of the clause but obviously not the noun closest
to it if the noun is not the subject of the clause.


Ron, after reading few of your posts about the modifiers the above was my understanding on the present participle modifiers. Please correct me if I am wrong.

I couldn't understand why this rule shouldn't hold true in the above question also.
To sum up, I agree that E is the best of the lot but I think that the word 'including' shouldn't have been preceded by a 'comma'. Please guide me if I am missing something here.

Thanks,

In have found all the including have been used after comma.

The general rule can be said that "COMMA+INCLUDING" is the correct form.


See the examples from New York Times:


The Educational Testing Service has announced that it is temporarily suspending registration for its tests in Iran, including the popular Test of English as a Foreign Language, in what may be one of the first tangible effects of the new sanctions levied against the country by the international community.

Mr. McConnell has not said how he will vote, but some influential Republican senators, including Judd Gregg of New Hampshire and Lamar Alexander of Tennessee, have said they will back Mr. Bernanke.

He then plunged into a comic song-and-dance number that poked fun at serious movies that were nominated for best picture, including "Milk" and "Frost/Nixon," and less serious movies that were not, including "The Dark Knight."

Now what can be concluded is that "Comma + Including" modifies the immediate preceding eligible NOUN.

More examples:

I have three books, including X and Y.
--> This means that I have X and Y and other one book.

They have suspended four employees, including John who have been arrested by police for committing crimes.

Now come to the question:

Although William Pereira first gained national recognition for his movie set designs, including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations remember him as the architect of the Transamerica Tower, the Malibu campus of Pepperdine University, and the city of Irvine.

(A) including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
(B) like that for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations will
(C) like those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
(D) including that for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
will
(E) including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
will

Here, "Comma + Including" modifies the immediate preceding NOUN, designs.

So the following two things are important:--

1. Those should be used to refer to the plural noun, designs.
2. Since the future generation has been mentioned, "future tense" MUST be used.

Answer is E.


I hope experts will help us more on this issue.

Thanks for the good question.

gmat_perfect@

there is no rule like "comma+including" as you have mentioned.

A 'comma+ing' modifies to the complete clause. : [ all we agree
It can modify to the closest noun also.

All depend on the context/meaning of the sentence.

See the Stuart response here :

https://www.beatthegmat.com/1000-sc-q31- ... ent=Boston

Gmat_perfect,
Thanks for the reply. First of all I would agree that I too have seen the use of 'including' with the 'comma' but I really don't know the reason of such an use. I wanted to know whether the use of 'including' after the comma is grammatical or the use is an exception to the rule of present participle modifier usage.


Paes,
Thanks for your reply.Commenting on your reply, i would say that according to my knowledge, grammatically the present participle when separated from the preceding clause with a 'comma' can modify the closest noun only when the noun is a subject of the preceding clause and not otherwise. If the noun is not the subject and the participle has to modify that noun then present participle has to be be used without a comma.
Kindly let me know if you differ from me on this. Please note that in the above example 'movie set designs' is not the subject of the preceding clause, so according to me for it to be modified by a present participle, it should be followed by the present participle without the comma. I hope I am clear to you with my point of discussion.

Thanks,

Thanks aiming800@

grammatically the present participle when separated from the preceding clause with a ‘comma’ can modify the closest noun only when the noun is a subject of the preceding clause and not otherwise. If the noun is not the subject and the participle has to modify that noun then present participle has to be be used without a comma.

--> I think you are right here.
some expert can tell if there is any exception here.

IMO: A

Hi Expert,

Still not clear: what is the difference between option A and E. both seems correct. A seems more more correct. Can you please explain?

Thanks in Advance...

@navami,

The problem in A is not the use of including but the absence of the modal will that is essential to sync the sentence with future generations.

Hi niksworth,

The incident happened in the past, so the "future generations" referred here can be the actual past (after 1940) or present generations. If this is true then I believe A can be a good choice. Still in doubt

navami wrote:Hi niksworth,

The incident happened in the past, so the "future generations" referred here can be the actual past (after 1940) or present generations. If this is true then I believe A can be a good choice. Still in doubt

Well, the catch here is in the non underlined portion
future generations remember him

Notice the use of remember.
For your logic to sound good (i.e. future generation refers to the generation future to 1940), the correct tense would have to be remembered.

Although William Pereira first gained national recognition in 1942 for his movie set designs, future generations remembered him as the architect of the Transamerica Tower

However, the non underlined portion contains remember and not remembered. So, A is wrong and E is right.

lunarpower wrote:

navami wrote:Hi niksworth,

The incident happened in the past, so the "future generations" referred here can be the actual past (after 1940) or present generations. If this is true then I believe A can be a good choice. Still in doubt

i see what you're saying, and it makes sense. however, in this sort of context, native speakers would take "future generations" as referring to generations that are still in the future at the time of narration. (this is not a general rule). i don't think that gmac would do this, so it's really a non-issue for test day; we should probably amend the problem to reflect that.

if we meant "generations that were in the future at that time but not now", we would write "later generations".

Thanks Ron!!!

Hi:

Why is E the correct answer... even D should be correct, isn't it?
Assume that 1942 film only had ONE set and William P got national recognition for it (like an award or something). In this case the sentence "Although William...designs, including that for the 1942 film..." also works, isn't it?

please help..

best,

As we know that in sentence where 'present participle + comma + Independent Clause (IC)', present participle modifies the subject of IC.
However below SC does not follow this rule. Why below B is incorrect ? Can someone elaborate ?
This SC is from OG12 and I can't understand their explanation about present participle modifier.
Am i missing something here?

Beatrix Potter, in her book illustrations, carefully coordinating them with her narratives, capitalized on her keen observation and love of the natural world.

(A) Beatrix Potter, in her book illustrations, carefully coordinating them with her narratives,
(B) In her book illustrations, carefully coordinating them with her narratives, Beatrix Potter
(C) In her book illustrations, which she carefully coordinated with her narratives, Beatrix Potter
(D) Carefully coordinated with her narratives, Beatrix Potter, in her book illustrations
(E) Beatrix Potter, in her book illustrations, carefully coordinated them with her narratives and