conclusion of the argument ?

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conclusion of the argument ?

by ranjithreddy.k9 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:19 pm
People should be held accountable for their own behavior, and if holding people accountable for their own behavior entails capital punishment, then so be it. However, no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control.

Which of the following is the most logical conclusion of the argument above?
(A) People should not be held accountable for the behavior of other people.
(B) People have control over their own behavior.
(C) People cannot control the behavior of other people.
(D) Behavior that cannot be controlled should not be punished.
(E) People have control over behavior that is subject to capital punishment.

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by vikram4689 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 6:46 pm
Premise: People should be held accountable for their behavior.
Premise: Even if accountability means giving capital punishment then give it.
Premise: Do not held people accountable for the behavior over which people do not have control

Pre-phrase: Capital punishment should not be given to people who do not have control over their behavior OR Capital punishment should be given to people who do have control over their behavior.

Now options:
(A) People should not be held accountable for the behavior of other people.
(B) People have control over their own behavior. (clearly said that some people do not have control over their behavior)
(C) People cannot control the behavior of other people.
(D) Behavior that cannot be controlled should not be punished. (first behavior is NOT punished, ikts the people that are punished. Secondly, about punishment we cannot say anything but capital punishment CANNOT be)
(E) People have control over behavior that is subject to capital punishment. (CORRECT)
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by ranjithreddy.k9 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 7:58 pm
Even i chose E ..but OA is B ...would be great if some one could explain B ?

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by vikram4689 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 8:12 pm
Requested David to respond to this question. ANyways what is the source. How can B be correct it is clearly mentioned "no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control. "
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by ranjithreddy.k9 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:37 pm
vikram4689 wrote:Requested David to respond to this question. ANyways what is the source. How can B be correct it is clearly mentioned "no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control. "
I totally agree with you vikram..btw source is 2minutegmat.com

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by LIL » Thu Jun 23, 2011 5:18 am
vikram4689 wrote: (B) People have control over their own behavior. (clearly said that some people do not have control over their behavior)
au contraire, monsieur, nowhere does it state that "some people do not have control over their behavior." rather, the paragraph says "no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control." this doesn't mean that some people have no control, it means that, sometimes, some behaviors cannot be controlled. logically it follows that if some behaviors cannot be controlled, some behaviors can controlled.

that said, you should also be able to figure this out using the first sentence: "people should be held accountable for their own behavior..." in order for the author to make this argument, the author must believe that people have at least some control over their behavior.

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by David@VeritasPrep » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:07 am
Got a PM on this one...

Lil' is right!!

The Correct answer is B. I must say that this is not very GMAT-like at all. As I was reading this I was thinking LSAT question and a very picky one at that. However, we have the question in front of us so let's see if we can learn from it.

The first statement is that "People should be held accountable for their own behavior." The bit about capital punishment is designed to throw you off and to set up false answer choices. Then we see at the end that "no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control."

Now in order for both statements to be true 1) that people should be held accountable for their behavior and 2) they should not be held accountable if they have no control.

So they must be able to control their own behavior. Choice B.

Now what about the other choices? They are all things that could be true, but the key is that they could be false as well. Take choice E for example, "People have control over behavior that is subject to capital punishment." How do we know? The stimulus never says what, in fact, is punished by capital punishment. Do you see? It may be that capital punishment is for something not controllable like, just to be extreme, blond hair.

As long as the stimulus does not mention a thing then we cannot say "must be true" and this stimulus does not say what capital punishment is for...
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by vikram4689 » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:49 am
People CAN control some behaviors & People CANNOT control some behaviors. Now how can option B be correct. Isnt it contradicted by statement - People CANNOT control some behaviors. I am talking B is "people have control over all of their behavior" - is this statement different from B.

How i deduced E: People should be held accountable for their behavior. Now from this, a subset of people can be entailed capital punishment. BUT the truth that remains is that all of those people will get capital punishment would be first held accountable. ....(1)
Argument also says that no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he does not have control. That means all those people who are held accountable have control over their behavior. ....(2)

From 1 & 2 i deduced E.


Now i got confused over D: Behavior that cannot be controlled should not be punished.
Is it that punished is never stated so we cannot deduce this. Actually i thought that accountable means punish. e.g. if a charge a $100 fine then in a way i am punishing the person.
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by David@VeritasPrep » Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:30 pm
People CAN control some behaviors & People CANNOT control some behaviors. Now how can option B be correct. Isnt it contradicted by statement - People CANNOT control some behaviors. I am talking B is "people have control over all of their behavior" - is this statement different from B.
This is incorrect. Remember that the premises on critical reasoning are always things that you take as being true. When you have an inference question, you must treat all of the premises as true. So we must accept as a fact these two things:

1) People should be held accountable for their own behavior.

2) no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control.

You have mis-stated the second part of this. Lil' mentioned this above...You have stated this as "People CANNOT control some behaviors." This is not correct. Look at 2) above. When it says behavior he or she cannot control this can certainly mean the behavior of other people. Nowhere does this say that you can control of your behaviors, but it also certainly does not indicate any behaviors of YOURS that you cannot control. This statement can mean that I am not sent to jail if you steal someone's car because I cannot control you.

Combine the two statements above and the only way that they can both be true is if you ARE in control of your own behavior. Remember that each word is important and many times you cannot simply paraphrase but must stick exactly to what is said.
How i deduced E: People should be held accountable for their behavior. Now from this, a subset of people can be entailed capital punishment. BUT the truth that remains is that all of those people will get capital punishment would be first held accountable. ....(1)
Argument also says that no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he does not have control. That means all those people who are held accountable have control over their behavior. ....(2)


No here you have made some assumptions. First of all you assume that people are only given capital punishment for something that they can control. Remember that you only have the facts that they give you. The whole thing about capital punishment is only there to confuse you since it really does not say much. The stimulus simply says "if holding people accountable for their own behavior entails capital punishment, then so be it."

Now what does this really say? Does it say that ALL capital punishment is given out for behavior? Does it say that people are not given capital punishment for the way they look or who there family is? Do you see what I mean? You are taking the real world into account as well as things like fairness. You must not do this. Stick only to what is said.

And as far as D is concerned, we are not told anything about behavior that cannot be controlled. Perhaps people should be punished for some compulsive behavior, such as gambling or drug use.
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by vikram4689 » Thu Jun 23, 2011 6:57 pm
when i say "People have control over their own behavior.". Doesn't it mean that
=> there is NO CHANCE that people cannot control their own behavior OR
=> People have control over ALL OF their own behavior
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by David@VeritasPrep » Thu Jun 23, 2011 7:34 pm
So you are quoting answer choice B "People have control over their own behavior."

And the answer is "yes" to both of your statements. It does mean that there is no chance that they cannot control and it does mean that they control ALL of their behavior.

This must be true in order for Both facts above to be true. Again, if it is true that

1) People should be held accountable for their own behavior.

2) no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control.

Do you see how people must be able to control their behavior? If not then they would not be accountable. #2 says don't hold people accountable if they have no control. But #1 says they are to be held accountable for their own behavior. This can only be true if they are always in control of all of their behavior.
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by vikram4689 » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:49 pm
Well i am thinking from the perspective that if a mad man commits some crime will he be held accountable because he does not have control so he should not be held accountable. OR does it come under the purview that People should be held accountable for their own behavior. Does here OWN means one's behavior be it controllable or not
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by David@VeritasPrep » Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:14 pm
Now we have the problem. You are using an outside perspective and not relying on what is said here in the argument.

The argument flatly states that people should be held accountable for their own behavior. So take that as a fact. Not something to be debated. So no madman that you want to give some understanding to. Also we know that 2) no person should be held accountable for behavior over which he or she had no control. Again a fact.

So what does it add up to? If we only hold people accountable if they have control and each person is accountable for their behavior? They must be in control. You must see these things as facts. There is no room for your scenario in these facts. The stimulus does not allow for someone who is not in control of their own behavior because then they would not be accountable and of course the stimulus says they are accountable. So no one is out of control - if they were they would not be accountable, but they are accountable.
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by vikram4689 » Fri Jun 24, 2011 3:16 am
Thanks this word OWN struck me in your last post only.[/b]
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