Tough CR..Please comment..

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Tough CR..Please comment..

by dhonu121 » Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:16 am
Math education in this country does a disservice to our children. In the lower grades, it should focus on the basic skills that students will need in higher grades to develop the ability to solve complex problems. Learning basic math skills is like learning the scales and chords that one will later use to master complicated concertos and symphonies. However, math educators in this country seem to have it backward, emphasizing in higher grades the same narrow, skills- based approach that students learned in lower grades rather than the analytical tools they will need to solve complex math problems. Which of the following, if true, would most seriously weaken the conclusion drawn above?
"¢ While music is common in elementary school curriculums, it is rarely taught in high school.
"¢ On international tests of math skills, high-school students in this country performed no worse than did their counterparts from countries where problem-solving is emphasized in higher grades.
"¢ When presented with a math problem to solve, students in higher grades are more likely to arrive at different answers than students in lowers grades are.
"¢ Older students tend to receive higher grades in math than do younger students.
"¢ Universities in this country report a steady increase in the percentage of native first-year students who qualify to take advanced mathematics courses such as calculus.

OA:E.

How to rule out B AND D ??
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by dimochka » Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:35 am
Hi,

(B) The key phrase is "no worse". It does not mean that the students in our country did better necessarily, as they could've done roughly as well as international students. This choice is too neutral to be the answer.
(D) We do not know what kind of courses are offered in higher math classes in comparison to those offer in lower. It's possible that the courses are similar, and students who are older and thus have taken these courses for longer will logically do better, but still show little to no improvement in their knowledge.

Choice [spoiler](C)[/spoiler] specifically states that the percentage of native students entering a university and able to handle advanced math courses is increasing - a direct contradiction of the passage, which claims that math skills remain weak.

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by dhonu121 » Sun Jun 17, 2012 7:48 pm
In E, the correct answer choice, aren't words such as university, calculus, First year native students being too specific and making the statement a little out of scope as compared to D which is TO THE POINT and within the scope.

Shouldn't D been correct ? It surely looks like a correct answer. :)
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by jimmyjimmy » Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:52 am
dhonu121 wrote:In E, the correct answer choice, aren't words such as university, calculus, First year native students being too specific and making the statement a little out of scope as compared to D which is TO THE POINT and within the scope.

Shouldn't D been correct ? It surely looks like a correct answer. :)
D speaks about old and young students........
in low grades there can be young and old students too....
we need to prove that the maths taught in lower grades is helpful in later life..which E says

one tip: we need to prove- low grade teaching is gona b useful in high grade,.,.,.,.

so take an answer choice which deals with low grade and high grade..
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by [email protected] » Wed Jun 20, 2012 10:48 pm
Math education in this country does a disservice to our children. In the lower grades, it should focus on the basic skills that students will need in higher grades to develop the ability to solve complex problems. Learning basic math skills is like learning the scales and chords that one will later use to master complicated concertos and symphonies. However, math educators in this country seem to have it backward, emphasizing in higher grades the same narrow, skills- based approach that students learned in lower grades rather than the analytical tools they will need to solve complex math problems.

Which of the following, if true, would most seriously weaken the conclusion drawn above?

A] While music is common in elementary school curriculums, it is rarely taught in high school.

B] On international tests of math skills, high-school students in this country performed no worse than did their counterparts from countries where problem-solving is emphasized in higher grades.

C] When presented with a math problem to solve, students in higher grades are more likely to arrive at different answers than students in lowers grades are.

D] Older students tend to receive higher grades in math than do younger students.

E] Universities in this country report a steady increase in the percentage of native first-year students who qualify to take advanced mathematics courses such as calculus.


I got lost between the options B and E. Let us reason again and explain all the options:


Conclusion: 'Math education in this country does a disservice to our children.'

Premise: In the lower grades the students should be learning the basic mathematical skills and in the higher grades the students should be learning the analytical skills required to solve more complex and difficult problems. But the system in our country is doing the opposite or solving the same questions or teaching the same things in the higher grades as they did in the lower grades. Hence disservice.


Option A: Completely out of scope for that matter... Not at all related to our conclusion.

Option B: Children following a system in our country are being compared to the children following the system in other countries following a different approach. This actually weakens the argument saying that there is actually no difference between the two approaches where students are performing the same or in the same region. So even when our (US) system has a different approach, there is no much difference between them and students of other countries. So there is no disservice done. So this can weaken the conclusion.

Also this option talks about the performance of the children studying in countries following different systems. Now there can be difference between students studying in the same system or same school or same institution. So performance of the children can be considered out of scope as well. What if the children are very smart and they are following a wrong approach and that is why they performed no bad or worse than the children under a different system. IN that case there is a disservice. So performance of the children can be out of scope for this argument hence neutral.


Option C: This strengthens the argument,saying that when the higher grade students have not yet mastered the skills they need more practice and hence the current system is better for our children.

Option D: Again out of scope. The comparison is not between older and younger students. The comparison is between higher grades and lower grade students. There is a lot of difference in the two terms. Hence the option D is out of scope.

Eg: What if a older (not very bright) student is in the lower grade and a younger (bright) student is or has reached in the higher grade. Therefore only the systems should be compared.

Option E: This weakens the argument. If the universities all over the country report that the students of our country have a steady increase in the marks or performance and it is specifically talking about the students who have entered the zone of solving mathematical problems, hence the current system is good enough for the current students can easily solve complex problems later on.

This option also strengthens the argument saying that if there is a steady increase in the mathematical skills then the higher grade students should be given complex and analytical tools that help in solving complex problems. Hence the current system is not good and hence a disservice.


I am stuck between the options B and E and I have given the reasoning for that.

I do not know which option is absolutely correct for the conclusion to make sense and do good.

Kindly all the experts please help...
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by sandeep_thaparianz » Thu Jun 21, 2012 3:23 am
Even I am confused between B and E.

Somebody please help.

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by hultt » Thu Jun 21, 2012 4:34 am
Math education in this country does a disservice to our children. In the lower grades, it should focus on the basic skills that students will need in higher grades to develop the ability to solve complex problems. Learning basic math skills is like learning the scales and chords that one will later use to master complicated concertos and symphonies. However, math educators in this country seem to have it backward, emphasizing in higher grades the same narrow, skills- based approach that students learned in lower grades rather than the analytical tools they will need to solve complex math problems.
Which of the following, if true, would most seriously weaken the conclusion drawn above?


Assumption here seems to be that as instructors are not emphasizing on analytical tools during high grades hence they are doing disservice to the nation.

"¢ While music is common in elementary school curriculums, it is rarely taught in high school.
>> irrelevant
"¢ On international tests of math skills, high-school students in this country performed no worse than did their counterparts from countries where problem-solving is emphasized in higher grades.
>> we are not comparing cross country
"¢ When presented with a math problem to solve, students in higher grades are more likely to arrive at different answers than students in lowers grades are.
>> does not hit the assumption
"¢ Older students tend to receive higher grades in math than do younger students.
>> does not hit the assumption
"¢ Universities in this country report a steady increase in the percentage of native first-year students who qualify to take advanced mathematics courses such as calculus.
>> this seems to hit the assumption with the word 'qualify' in the statement. there could have been more students for calculus as well but it clears that there is no disservice being done to nation as these students qualify for calculus i.e. are competent enough for calculus

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by vk_vinayak » Thu Jun 21, 2012 5:23 am
Conclusion: Math education in this country does a disservice to our children.

Narrowed down to B and E.

B. 'No worse' means students of this country might have performed exactly as did international students. It could be that the math educators in the compared counties may also be doing disservice to their children.

E. It clearly states about native students. Increasing number of native students qualifying for Calculus (advanced maths) shows that native students are able to apply skills learned in lower-grades to in solve complex problems.

I choose E.
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by ronnie1985 » Thu Jun 21, 2012 8:37 pm
Really a tough choice to make.

Maths education doing disservice to the children of the country... The argument's conclusion. The premise touches upon the way educators teach students. It says that the educators teach same basic skills in higher as well as lower grades. The author says that something more than basic skill in Maths is required to solve complex Maths questions - Analytical Skills - not taught by educators.
(A) out of scope
(B) Students of the country performed at par with international students in Math test that is biased to wards Problem Solving - not hurting the conclusion that the education style is doing disservice to the children of the nation. The education system is preparing students to perform at par with international students, not making them better at solving problems. But we can keep that option, if we do not get something better.
(C) This actually strengthens the conclusion
(D) older students performing better than younger students of same class - Older students better at basic math skill than younger students does not weaken the conclusion
(E)Increase in %age of students (native) who "QUALIFY" to take advanced Math course - This shows that the education system is serving well for the students in enabling them to "QUALIFY" for advanced MAth classes. The education system is doing "GOOD" for students, not providing disservice to students. This definitely weakens the conclusion, and hence better than (B), which does not soecifically implies that the education system is doing good for native students.

I hope it helps you explain the OA.
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by Gaurav 2013-fall » Mon Jun 25, 2012 7:30 am
[email protected] wrote:Math education in this country does a disservice to our children. In the lower grades, it should focus on the basic skills that students will need in higher grades to develop the ability to solve complex problems. Learning basic math skills is like learning the scales and chords that one will later use to master complicated concertos and symphonies. However, math educators in this country seem to have it backward, emphasizing in higher grades the same narrow, skills- based approach that students learned in lower grades rather than the analytical tools they will need to solve complex math problems.

Which of the following, if true, would most seriously weaken the conclusion drawn above?

A] While music is common in elementary school curriculums, it is rarely taught in high school.

B] On international tests of math skills, high-school students in this country performed no worse than did their counterparts from countries where problem-solving is emphasized in higher grades.

C] When presented with a math problem to solve, students in higher grades are more likely to arrive at different answers than students in lowers grades are.

D] Older students tend to receive higher grades in math than do younger students.

E] Universities in this country report a steady increase in the percentage of native first-year students who qualify to take advanced mathematics courses such as calculus.


I got lost between the options B and E. Let us reason again and explain all the options:


Conclusion: 'Math education in this country does a disservice to our children.'

Premise: In the lower grades the students should be learning the basic mathematical skills and in the higher grades the students should be learning the analytical skills required to solve more complex and difficult problems. But the system in our country is doing the opposite or solving the same questions or teaching the same things in the higher grades as they did in the lower grades. Hence disservice.


Option A: Completely out of scope for that matter... Not at all related to our conclusion.

Option B: Children following a system in our country are being compared to the children following the system in other countries following a different approach. This actually weakens the argument saying that there is actually no difference between the two approaches where students are performing the same or in the same region. So even when our (US) system has a different approach, there is no much difference between them and students of other countries. So there is no disservice done. So this can weaken the conclusion.

Also this option talks about the performance of the children studying in countries following different systems. Now there can be difference between students studying in the same system or same school or same institution. So performance of the children can be considered out of scope as well. What if the children are very smart and they are following a wrong approach and that is why they performed no bad or worse than the children under a different system. IN that case there is a disservice. So performance of the children can be out of scope for this argument hence neutral.


Option C: This strengthens the argument,saying that when the higher grade students have not yet mastered the skills they need more practice and hence the current system is better for our children.

Option D: Again out of scope. The comparison is not between older and younger students. The comparison is between higher grades and lower grade students. There is a lot of difference in the two terms. Hence the option D is out of scope.

Eg: What if a older (not very bright) student is in the lower grade and a younger (bright) student is or has reached in the higher grade. Therefore only the systems should be compared.

Option E: This weakens the argument. If the universities all over the country report that the students of our country have a steady increase in the marks or performance and it is specifically talking about the students who have entered the zone of solving mathematical problems, hence the current system is good enough for the current students can easily solve complex problems later on.

This option also strengthens the argument saying that if there is a steady increase in the mathematical skills then the higher grade students should be given complex and analytical tools that help in solving complex problems. Hence the current system is not good and hence a disservice.


I am stuck between the options B and E and I have given the reasoning for that.

I do not know which option is absolutely correct for the conclusion to make sense and do good.

Kindly all the experts please help...

I am no expert, but still think I can help you. In one of your earlier posts, you gave a very critical advice that every word is important in an arg. In this one, you seem to forget your own advice.

Choice B says about problem solving skills, whereas the arg says the importance of analytical skills in the higher classes.

If you understand the argument very well, choosing a right answer is a mere formality.
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by dhonu121 » Mon Jun 25, 2012 7:46 am
I am the one who posted this problem and I seem to have understood the reasoning behind it by now.
I was primarily confused between D and E.
However, it seems that B is also a distractor.
So basically, B talks about worst performance of one set of students compared to another set of students. So that tells us that the lowest score scored by both set of students is same.
However, what it does not tell is what is the average performance of students. It might be that on an average level students from countries where problem-solving is emphasized in higher grades performed better.
Nonetheless, it might be otherwise.Hence B alone is not sufficiently weakening the argument.

D says something about older and younger students. Students in a single grade can be older to one another or younger to one another. Older student does not mean that the student is in a higher grade.

E is the only choice left. Hence go for E.
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by [email protected] » Mon Jun 25, 2012 10:36 am
I think the biggest problem with B is that we don't know what skills are tested on the international tests. It is entirely possible that the tests are focused on basic math skills rather than higher-level problem solving. If so, then the fact that our high school students performed no worse than students who were exposed to problem solving is irrelevant to the conclusion.
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