708. The Coast guard is conducting tests to see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
(A) to see whether pigeons can be trained to help find
(B) to see whether pigeons can be trained as help to find
(C) to see if pigeons can be trained for helping to find
(D) that see if pigeons are able to be trained in helping to find
(E) that see whether pigeons are able to be trained for help in finding
OA A
Why it can't be B? Please provide explanations.
SC1000 Q708
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"trained to" is idomatic
"trained as" is not....
"trained as" is not....
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Original Sentence:sharkin wrote:My doubt is regarding the the correct use of "THAT" ...
What if, one of the given options was: "that see whether pigeons can be trained to help find" ? Is it correct? How do you see it in comparison to option A?
The Coast guard is conducting tests to see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
What does the sentence mean: The sentence shows a fact that Coast Guard is conducting some tests. It further states the purpose of these tests.
Your choice:
The Coast guard is conducting tests that see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
This sentence has SV pair that does not make sense. "That" refers to tests. Thus the subject-verb pair for the clause 'that see...' is 'tests-see'. This does not make sense since tests cannot see. Furthermore, the original sentence implies that by conducting these tests, the coast guard will see whether the pigeons can be trained.
I hope this makes sense.
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Hi,e-GMAT wrote:Original Sentence:sharkin wrote:My doubt is regarding the the correct use of "THAT" ...
What if, one of the given options was: "that see whether pigeons can be trained to help find" ? Is it correct? How do you see it in comparison to option A?
The Coast guard is conducting tests to see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
What does the sentence mean: The sentence shows a fact that Coast Guard is conducting some tests. It further states the purpose of these tests.
Your choice:
The Coast guard is conducting tests that see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
This sentence has SV pair that does not make sense. "That" refers to tests. Thus the subject-verb pair for the clause 'that see...' is 'tests-see'. This does not make sense since tests cannot see. Furthermore, the original sentence implies that by conducting these tests, the coast guard will see whether the pigeons can be trained.
I hope this makes sense.
What is the key difference between
"pigeons can be trained to help"
"pigeons can be trained for helping"
How do we decided which choice is better (considering everything else in the sentence is the same)
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neha.patni wrote:708. The Coast guard is conducting tests to see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
(A) to see whether pigeons can be trained to help find
(B) to see whether pigeons can be trained as help to find
(C) to see if pigeons can be trained for helping to find
(D) that see if pigeons are able to be trained in helping to find
(E) that see whether pigeons are able to be trained for help in finding
OA A
POOR post, without any underline, bold of the portion under study.
IMO: It will not help any
Why it can't be B? Please provide explanations.
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Hi Payal Could you please explain option Be-GMAT wrote:Original Sentence:sharkin wrote:My doubt is regarding the the correct use of "THAT" ...
What if, one of the given options was: "that see whether pigeons can be trained to help find" ? Is it correct? How do you see it in comparison to option A?
The Coast guard is conducting tests to see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
What does the sentence mean: The sentence shows a fact that Coast Guard is conducting some tests. It further states the purpose of these tests.
Your choice:
The Coast guard is conducting tests that see whether pigeons can be trained to help find survivors of wrecks at sea.
This sentence has SV pair that does not make sense. "That" refers to tests. Thus the subject-verb pair for the clause 'that see...' is 'tests-see'. This does not make sense since tests cannot see. Furthermore, the original sentence implies that by conducting these tests, the coast guard will see whether the pigeons can be trained.
I hope this makes sense.
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My strategy to solve this question was:"Help Find"-- that's the right option. Rest of the sentence is absolutely correct. The only distorted portion really is "Help find" on other options.
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In this sentence "to help" is correct. In this sentence the inherent meaning that you want to communicate is "purpose" or "intention". Pigeons can be trained - trained to do what - trained to help. You are telling the purpose of "training".robosc9 wrote: Hi,
What is the key difference between
"pigeons can be trained to help"
"pigeons can be trained for helping"
How do we decided which choice is better (considering everything else in the sentence is the same)
"for verb-ing" is NOT always INCORRECT. Do not eliminate an answer choice just because you see this construction. You need to evaluate this on a case by case basis.
When is "to verb" better than "for verb-ing" - When the intended meaning explicitly states the intention or purpose.
Example: In this sentence, it is apparent that the PURPOSE of reducing software prices is TO decrease the incentive for pirating. Thus, in this sentence "to decrease" is correct.
Now lets see a correct usage of "for verb-ing"
OG12# 40: Dr. Tonegawa won the Nobel Prize for discovering how the body can constantly change its genes to fashion...
In this sentence, "to discover" will be incorrect since it will change the intended meaning of the sentence. The sentence implies that Dr. Tonegawa won the Nobel Prize. It then explains what for he won the Nobel Prize. He won it for discovering how the body changes...
If we replace for verb-ing with "to verb" here, then the sentence will imply that the purpose of Dr. Tonegawa to win the Nobel Prize was to discover how body changes...
Thus, if the context of the sentence requires you to express an INTENT, then you should use "to verb". Now some words require use of "to verb" because of their inherent meaning. This is tested in Questions 51 & 73.
In #51: ability for distinguishing is incorrect. It should be ability to distinguish. This makes complete sense. When we express the idea of "ability", automatically we think "ability to do something" - So the idea of INTENT comes in and hence we should use ability to verb and not ability for verb-ing.
Similarly in #73 - when we say the word "equipped",the meaning is such that we know that there is an intent involved. People are equipped to do something. There is an intent behind getting equipped. And hence "equipped to verb" is more appropriate.
Also check out Question #15. In this question, "to take" is correct and "for taking" is incorrect. This is because the intended meaning here is to show the purpose.
Here are some OG12 questions in which "for verb-ing" is correct:
6, 106, 107
Take-Away Message
We should use "to verb" in place of "for verb-ing" when the meaning has show "intent". In certain other cases, "to verb" will not make sense since "intent" is not the correct meaning. In certain other cases, both to verb and for verb-ing will be correct. Go with the context...
Let me know if you have any doubts about this.
Payal
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Thank you so much for a detailed explanation!e-GMAT wrote: Here are some OG12 questions in which "for verb-ing" is correct:
6, 106, 107
I was reading question 107 (OG12). None of the choices have 'to develop'. My question is - had choice A been:
"Originally developed to detect air pollutants,....."
instead of
"Originally developed for detecting air pollutants,....."
Would it still be correct? (The infinitive 'to' fits here to state intention?). Please let me know! Thanks!
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Hi Payal......Than ks a lot for this explaination
can you please let me know the sentence structure for option B
that it hampers the ability of some children to
distinguish discrete sounds and words and, as a
result, to make
what is "as a result" should we not read this while reading the complete sentence to make better sense ?
I am confused when I see some thing separated by 2 commas
Thanks
can you please let me know the sentence structure for option B
that it hampers the ability of some children to
distinguish discrete sounds and words and, as a
result, to make
what is "as a result" should we not read this while reading the complete sentence to make better sense ?
I am confused when I see some thing separated by 2 commas
Thanks
If my post helped you- let me know by pushing the thanks button. Thanks
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Yes in this sentence both "to verb" and "for verb-ing" are correct.robosc9 wrote:Thank you so much for a detailed explanation!e-GMAT wrote: Here are some OG12 questions in which "for verb-ing" is correct:
6, 106, 107
I was reading question 107 (OG12). None of the choices have 'to develop'. My question is - had choice A been:
"Originally developed to detect air pollutants,....."
instead of
"Originally developed for detecting air pollutants,....."
Would it still be correct? (The infinitive 'to' fits here to state intention?). Please let me know! Thanks!
"To verb" - the intention of developing the technique.
"for verb-ing" - the purpose of the technique
Originally developed (with the intention) to detect air pollutants, ...
Originally developed (for the purpose) for detecting air pollutants, ...
Hope this helps.
Payal
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Hi 1947,1947 wrote:Hi Payal......Than ks a lot for this explaination
can you please let me know the sentence structure for option B
that it hampers the ability of some children to
distinguish discrete sounds and words and, as a
result, to make
what is "as a result" should we not read this while reading the complete sentence to make better sense ?
I am confused when I see some thing separated by 2 commas
Thanks
I would be happy to help out, but can you please post the complete sentence. I could not find this sentence discussed in this thread.
Thanks,
Payal
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Hi Egmat whats the difference between Intent and purpose . I think both mean the samee-GMAT wrote:Yes in this sentence both "to verb" and "for verb-ing" are correct.robosc9 wrote:Thank you so much for a detailed explanation!e-GMAT wrote: Here are some OG12 questions in which "for verb-ing" is correct:
6, 106, 107
I was reading question 107 (OG12). None of the choices have 'to develop'. My question is - had choice A been:
"Originally developed to detect air pollutants,....."
instead of
"Originally developed for detecting air pollutants,....."
Would it still be correct? (The infinitive 'to' fits here to state intention?). Please let me know! Thanks!
"To verb" - the intention of developing the technique.
"for verb-ing" - the purpose of the technique
Originally developed (with the intention) to detect air pollutants, ...
Originally developed (for the purpose) for detecting air pollutants, ...
Hope this helps.
Payal
In 1 of your posts above you mentioned that to verb could also be used to indicate purpose .Then doesnt this post contradict that post
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