just curious, I've seen a lot on the major media the usage like What you should do is go out and take a breath.
As in SC, I thought it should be what you should do is to go out and take a breath.
Want to be sure whether this is a common mistake among native speakers or something like an idiom. Thanks for any possible illumination!
sorry if it seems too nitpicking.
A Common Mistake or An idiom usage.
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- magic monkey
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I think it's fine without the "to". Why do you think we need the infinitive there?
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- magic monkey
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Hi Bill, I thought it should be a noun phrase following a BE verb. the infinitive "to go out" is a noun phrase but "go out" is not.
It's a basic rule, isn't it?
Why so many native speakers talk without the "to"? Is it grammatically wrong? Or something we could also use in a serious formal writing?
sentences like "What you should do is go out and take a breath."
It's a basic rule, isn't it?
Why so many native speakers talk without the "to"? Is it grammatically wrong? Or something we could also use in a serious formal writing?
sentences like "What you should do is go out and take a breath."
- magic monkey
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Hi Bill, I thought it should be a noun phrase following a BE verb. the infinitive "to go out" is a noun phrase but "go out" is not.Bill@VeritasPrep wrote:I think it's fine without the "to". Why do you think we need the infinitive there?
It's a basic rule, isn't it?
Why so many native speakers talk without the "to"? Is it grammatically wrong? Or something we could also use in a serious formal writing?
sentences like "What you should do is go out and take a breath."
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- lunarpower
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I received a private message about this thread.
First and foremost... this:
You shouldn't do that. Because...
Spoken English and written English are DIFFERENT LANGUAGES.
They have different grammars.
They have different vocabularies.
They have different sentence structures.
Etc.
Constructions that are fundamental building blocks of one of these are often completely absent from the other.
E.g.,
My brother, a sales manager, lives in Texas.
This kind of modifier is a basic building block of written English, but doesn't exist at all in spoken English.
That's just one example, but you get the point. They're different languages. Using your eyes to evaluate spoken English is just as wrong as using your ear to evaluate written English (although only the latter will hurt your gmat score).
First and foremost... this:
This is the biggest mistake here. You're trying to evaluate spoken English by the standards of written English.Want to be sure whether this is a common mistake among native speakers
You shouldn't do that. Because...
Spoken English and written English are DIFFERENT LANGUAGES.
They have different grammars.
They have different vocabularies.
They have different sentence structures.
Etc.
Constructions that are fundamental building blocks of one of these are often completely absent from the other.
E.g.,
My brother, a sales manager, lives in Texas.
This kind of modifier is a basic building block of written English, but doesn't exist at all in spoken English.
That's just one example, but you get the point. They're different languages. Using your eyes to evaluate spoken English is just as wrong as using your ear to evaluate written English (although only the latter will hurt your gmat score).
Ron has been teaching various standardized tests for 20 years.
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In writing, neither of these would work.magic monkey wrote:just curious, I've seen a lot on the major media the usage like What you should do is go out and take a breath.
As in SC, I thought it should be what you should do is to go out and take a breath.
"Go out" is grammatically verboten. A verb can't act as a noun.
"To go out" would work in terms of pure mechanics, but the meaning isn't right.
"To ____", if used as a noun, should be a reference to the general/abstract/conceptual idea of ____ing. It's not appropriate for an urgent suggestion (as in this example), since such a suggestion isn't a general notion.
If the sentence were a generalization-The best option for many people under stress is to go outside and relax-then, sure.
Ron has been teaching various standardized tests for 20 years.
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Pueden hacerle preguntas a Ron en castellano
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Voit esittää kysymyksiä Ron:lle myös suomeksi
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Quand on se sent bien dans un vêtement, tout peut arriver. Un bon vêtement, c'est un passeport pour le bonheur.
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- magic monkey
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Actually, I never thought of it like that before. It may be quite basic for the native speaker, but I think it's quite eye-opening for me. Thanks Ron!lunarpower wrote:I received a private message about this thread.
First and foremost... this:This is the biggest mistake here. You're trying to evaluate spoken English by the standards of written English.Want to be sure whether this is a common mistake among native speakers
You shouldn't do that. Because...
Spoken English and written English are DIFFERENT LANGUAGES.
They have different grammars.
They have different vocabularies.
They have different sentence structures.
Etc.
Constructions that are fundamental building blocks of one of these are often completely absent from the other.
E.g.,
My brother, a sales manager, lives in Texas.
This kind of modifier is a basic building block of written English, but doesn't exist at all in spoken English.
That's just one example, but you get the point. They're different languages. Using your eyes to evaluate spoken English is just as wrong as using your ear to evaluate written English (although only the latter will hurt your gmat score).
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- lunarpower
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Not "basic"/"obvious" at all for native speakers, actually. In fact, native speakers--excepting only those with unusually deep ability and/or enthusiasm for the written word--have more trouble with the spoken language/written language distinction. After all, they're the ones who have spoken the spoken language for their entire lives!magic monkey wrote:Actually, I never thought of it like that before. It may be quite basic for the native speaker, but I think it's quite eye-opening for me. Thanks Ron!
E.g.,
In SPOKEN English, "which" only seldom refers to nouns. It's normally used to describe entire clauses (e.g., My sister crashed the car, which really made my dad mad).
"¢ Before native English speakers can absorb the proper written usage of "which" (in which the sentence above is nonsense), they must actively un-learn (or, more accurately, quarantine) the spoken-language instinct.
"¢ Non-native speakers face no such obstacle; they simply must learn the correct written usage.
in fact, GMAC tests forms that clash with their spoken usage (or that simply don't exist in the spoken language) quite often, for the express purpose of making the test more fair for non-native English speakers.
Ron has been teaching various standardized tests for 20 years.
--
Pueden hacerle preguntas a Ron en castellano
Potete chiedere domande a Ron in italiano
On peut poser des questions à Ron en français
Voit esittää kysymyksiä Ron:lle myös suomeksi
--
Quand on se sent bien dans un vêtement, tout peut arriver. Un bon vêtement, c'est un passeport pour le bonheur.
Yves Saint-Laurent
--
Learn more about ron
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Pueden hacerle preguntas a Ron en castellano
Potete chiedere domande a Ron in italiano
On peut poser des questions à Ron en français
Voit esittää kysymyksiä Ron:lle myös suomeksi
--
Quand on se sent bien dans un vêtement, tout peut arriver. Un bon vêtement, c'est un passeport pour le bonheur.
Yves Saint-Laurent
--
Learn more about ron
- magic monkey
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that's right, the different usages of Which Clause! It was like the first confusing point when I started learning GMAT.lunarpower wrote:Not "basic"/"obvious" at all for native speakers, actually. In fact, native speakers--excepting only those with unusually deep ability and/or enthusiasm for the written word--have more trouble with the spoken language/written language distinction. After all, they're the ones who have spoken the spoken language for their entire lives!magic monkey wrote:Actually, I never thought of it like that before. It may be quite basic for the native speaker, but I think it's quite eye-opening for me. Thanks Ron!
E.g.,
In SPOKEN English, "which" only seldom refers to nouns. It's normally used to describe entire clauses (e.g., My sister crashed the car, which really made my dad mad).
"¢ Before native English speakers can absorb the proper written usage of "which" (in which the sentence above is nonsense), they must actively un-learn (or, more accurately, quarantine) the spoken-language instinct.
"¢ Non-native speakers face no such obstacle; they simply must learn the correct written usage.
in fact, GMAC tests forms that clash with their spoken usage (or that simply don't exist in the spoken language) quite often, for the express purpose of making the test more fair for non-native English speakers.
Cool I'll keep that.
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If you notice any constructions that are used in contradictory / opposite / significantly different ways in the two languages (spoken and written English), you should pay more than the usual amount of attention to them.magic monkey wrote:that's right, the different usages of Which Clause! It was like the first confusing point when I started learning GMAT.
Cool I'll keep that. :P
(As another example, consider pronouns.
In SPOKEN English, they're not really "pronouns"; they're more like "pro-whatever you want".
E.g.,
In Colombia, they eat a lot of potatoes.
In written English, this sentence is incorrect, since "they" doesn't stand for anyone. In the spoken language it's ok; it's understood to mean people in Colombia.
("A lot" is also inappropriate in the written language, unless you are talking about a literal "lot", e.g., I bought 10 lots of this product to sell in my store. Same for "a bunch", "a ton", and many other informal words that have specific literal meanings in the formal written language.)
Or
My sister crashed the car; my dad was furious when he found out about it.
Wrong in written English; fine in spoken English. ("it" is trying to stand for the entire idea that my sister crashed the car.)
GMAC will test such constructions more heavily than most others. Much more heavily, in fact, because they represent one of GMAC's most powerful ways of making the test more fair for non-native vs. native English speakers.
Ron has been teaching various standardized tests for 20 years.
--
Pueden hacerle preguntas a Ron en castellano
Potete chiedere domande a Ron in italiano
On peut poser des questions à Ron en français
Voit esittää kysymyksiä Ron:lle myös suomeksi
--
Quand on se sent bien dans un vêtement, tout peut arriver. Un bon vêtement, c'est un passeport pour le bonheur.
Yves Saint-Laurent
--
Learn more about ron
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Pueden hacerle preguntas a Ron en castellano
Potete chiedere domande a Ron in italiano
On peut poser des questions à Ron en français
Voit esittää kysymyksiä Ron:lle myös suomeksi
--
Quand on se sent bien dans un vêtement, tout peut arriver. Un bon vêtement, c'est un passeport pour le bonheur.
Yves Saint-Laurent
--
Learn more about ron
- magic monkey
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LOVE your extension on it! Thanks!lunarpower wrote:If you notice any constructions that are used in contradictory / opposite / significantly different ways in the two languages (spoken and written English), you should pay more than the usual amount of attention to them.magic monkey wrote:that's right, the different usages of Which Clause! It was like the first confusing point when I started learning GMAT.
Cool I'll keep that.
(As another example, consider pronouns.
In SPOKEN English, they're not really "pronouns"; they're more like "pro-whatever you want".
E.g.,
In Colombia, they eat a lot of potatoes.
In written English, this sentence is incorrect, since "they" doesn't stand for anyone. In the spoken language it's ok; it's understood to mean people in Colombia.
("A lot" is also inappropriate in the written language, unless you are talking about a literal "lot", e.g., I bought 10 lots of this product to sell in my store. Same for "a bunch", "a ton", and many other informal words that have specific literal meanings in the formal written language.)
Or
My sister crashed the car; my dad was furious when he found out about it.
Wrong in written English; fine in spoken English. ("it" is trying to stand for the entire idea that my sister crashed the car.)
GMAC will test such constructions more heavily than most others. Much more heavily, in fact, because they represent one of GMAC's most powerful ways of making the test more fair for non-native vs. native English speakers.
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You're welcome.
You should always ask "Why?" about every type of question on this test. If you understand what is emphasized (and what isn't) on this exam-in terms of both content and skills-you'll find the whole experience much more circumscribed, and much less daunting.
You should always ask "Why?" about every type of question on this test. If you understand what is emphasized (and what isn't) on this exam-in terms of both content and skills-you'll find the whole experience much more circumscribed, and much less daunting.
Ron has been teaching various standardized tests for 20 years.
--
Pueden hacerle preguntas a Ron en castellano
Potete chiedere domande a Ron in italiano
On peut poser des questions à Ron en français
Voit esittää kysymyksiä Ron:lle myös suomeksi
--
Quand on se sent bien dans un vêtement, tout peut arriver. Un bon vêtement, c'est un passeport pour le bonheur.
Yves Saint-Laurent
--
Learn more about ron
--
Pueden hacerle preguntas a Ron en castellano
Potete chiedere domande a Ron in italiano
On peut poser des questions à Ron en français
Voit esittää kysymyksiä Ron:lle myös suomeksi
--
Quand on se sent bien dans un vêtement, tout peut arriver. Un bon vêtement, c'est un passeport pour le bonheur.
Yves Saint-Laurent
--
Learn more about ron